Group drum Editing: Out of Sync?????

I recently tracked many drum takes to Cubase 6.02. ALL of the tracking was done while all of the drum channels were in a group and sync’d. I just pulled it up, and disabling and then enabling group edit says my tracks are out of sync! WHY?! HOW?!?!? None of the tracks were ungrouped at any point.

Group edit, in my opinion, is BROKEN. This is the most recent of endless troubles I’ve had with maintaining group edit sync.

I know for a bug report I am supposed to state what I did and how it can be reproduced… Well, I have no real idea what I did to lose sync on these tracks. They are completely raw, and have been grouped since their inception.

Did you cut the tracks at any point with snap to zero on?

+1. It gives you a barely visible but ragged edge as the STZ is done independently for each track/lane.

I would just like to take the opportunity (again) to say that losing synch this easily shouldn’t be happening, it’s almost as if it’s based entirely on start points. The same thing happens if you try to line up audio that was recorded through two mics placed at different distances.

There needs to be a way of saying to Cubase: no, these tracks are in synch.

And end points!!!

Hmm. I think this might be another example of having to upgrade work-practices along with the s/w! And I missed the stuff on grouping audio events (p.64) because it’s not in the Group Editing section (p.80).

If it’s all down to start/end points (and playback priority), then I suppose we have to start looking at event boundaries as placeholders - a window behind which you slip-edit (Ctrl-Alt-drag) the audio. All cut nice and neat with Snap-To-Zero off, of course, which won’t matter by the time x-fades etc have been done.

I’m not on an appropriate project to give it a thorough road-test right now but the temporary grouping described on p.64 may be the ‘reset’ button I’ve been calling for, although I must admit I don’t at present quite get how the note at the end of p.80 might affect this (I know, I’m just a bit thick…). However, thinking about it, if I use the events as placeholders, as suggested above, then the whole question of losing sync should be irrelevant.

Hope I haven’t hi-jacked this thread with all this, but I’m off now to check over and maybe amend a few of my earlier posts.

Hope it helps, anyway.

Cheers,
C

Was recording and editing drums yesterday (and today), multiple dropins and using quantise panel on some parts and I must admit it all went swimmingly well. I did get a couple of out of sync messages but on closer examination it was due to unequal part lengths. I always use slip edit for manual editing on kits anyway. when I’m finished and happy I bounce audio to consolidate the edits.

+1 on that. when you get the not in sync may fail warning the affected track/s will not highlight within the group thus giving you a visual indication as to which track/s are the problem.

I think a lot of the problems are from people cutting with Snap To Zero enabled!

Thanks for the replies.

I never use snap to zero. I think it is theoretically brilliant. But in practice, it means you can’t snap you audio tracks to the grid accurately. I stopped using a it a long time ago.

Also, if I edit a track in a folder that’s in group edit mode, I fully EXPECT every edit I make to be mirrored exactly on every track in that folder. The problem is, this doesn’t always happen. Here’s a problem with group edit I can (nearly) always reproduce:

In any grouped and sync’d folder, click directly on the first audio track. it should highlight just that track. (Actually it shouldn’t, but it does). Split anywhere on that highlight even. Is it mirrored on the other tracks? Most times not. Sometimes, yes. Now disable and enable group edit. Out of sync? Darn near every time.

I run into so many inconsistencies using the group edit feature that I am amazed this forum isn’t swimming in posts about it. I can only assume most people aren’t using the feature much?

I have same problem here drums goes out of sync randomly and the group edit sometimes fail to highlight all the grouped tracks in the group. Pretty useless at this point I think. Never use snap at zero or size the files individually

I have to agree that Group Edit needs a fine tuning. I’m disappointed that the fixes in 6.05 don’t include some for Group Edit. Having said that I DO keep snap to zero on and will try turning it off when I start editing on another project. I was bragging about how cool the lanes were to a client today as he was watching me edit. All of a sudden all of the edits weren’t showing up in the other tracks. Bummer.

Replying this old post because I get the same “out of sync may fail” error message when trying to group edit in Cubase 9. Can I fix this with current tracks in a group folde?

As mentioned above, this can happen when you’ve been editing with snap-to-zero on. It can also happen if you adjust start/end points in an editor: group editing misses these changes.

Golden rule with Group Editing - Don’t use snap-to-zero and do all your editing in the Project window.

As far as fixing goes, I’d try using grid set to Events, snap-to-zero off, and try to sync things up that way. But Group Edit is very sensitive…

I’ve been researching this and cannot understand the reason or solution. I don’t remember ever having this issue. I track a lot of drums and have also overdubbed sections with multi passes before without issue. Recently I tracked 8 tracks of drums, cued up to the start ( snap to zero was off) played a take. Stopped and cued back to the start and recorded another take. I did this 6 times. The start points are the same but endings were stopped randomly when I was finished a take. I cannot group edit due to the out of sync error. So when I go to the lanes and try to audition different takes it does not work. How do I avoid this in the future and how do I fix so I can audition and edit my takes?

I viewed a Youtube video of a fix which called for editing audio - events to part, but this did not fix the issue.

I think this is your problem. I remember posting about this ages ago and the upshot of it was that the parts to be synced have to have exactly the same start and end points. So if you can see a way of doing it without chopping anything vital off, trim all your takes to the same length. As usual, make sure Snap-to-zero is off because otherwise you may get a microscopically ragged edge - even when snapping to grid - and that’s enough to get a sync error.

Great - Thank you

You’re welcome. And one other thing, don’t use the audio editor to resize because Group Edit doesn’t notice (!) so always do all your sizing in the Project. Cheers, C