Hairpin alignment in grouped instruments - bug?

[MassMover]

In the attached picture all dynamics are grouped. As you can see the decrescendo in the lowest voice is longer than the others. This is due to an option in the extended engraving options for dynamics: Hairpins that end before a note on downbeat may cross the barline.

This seems wrong. Although the hairpins in the other staffs would officially be allowed to cross the barline they actually don’t. Below the lowest voice there is no barline, so obviously Dorico allows the hairpin there to be longer.

I would expect that all hairpins should exceed the barline as they do in the lowest staff. Generally I would expect Dorico to not treat the lowest staff differently, the grouping of the dynamics should overrule the presence/absence of the barline.

When I change the setting to “do not cross barline” all hairpins end at the same horizontal position. But, of course then the crescendos that end in the first shown bar end before the barline.

[dspreadbury]

Dorico won’t allow hairpins to cross barlines unless there’s room for a decent chunk of the hairpin to be drawn after the barline, e.g. if there is a time signature or key signature at that barline. Otherwise it stops the hairpin short of the barline to avoid a tiny bit of the hairpin poking through.

[jgg]

Hi folks. In the attached pic, the cresc marks protrude way beyond the bar-line, which looks unnatural to me. There’s a rest in that bar! It looks especially bad in the parts, where there’s no lower part, which I’m assuming the hairpin is aligning to.
In Engraving Options > Horizontal Position > Relative to Barlines, I’ve tried various positive and negative amounts for both of the possible settings, and there is no difference at all in the look.
How can I align the end of the hairpin with the barline?
I’m running Pro 2.2.

[Derrek]

Select the hairpin and use ALT+SHIFT+LEFT ARROW to shorten it.

[dankreider]

@jgg

Hi folks. In the attached pic, the cresc marks protrude way beyond the bar-line, which looks unnatural to me. There’s a rest in that bar! It looks especially bad in the parts, where there’s no lower part, which I’m assuming the hairpin is aligning to.
In Engraving Options > Horizontal Position > Relative to Barlines, I’ve tried various positive and negative amounts for both of the possible settings, and there is no difference at all in the look.
How can I align the end of the hairpin with the barline?
I’m running Pro 2.2.

Those hairpins are simply wrong. They were entered incorrectly, I’m almost positive. Perhaps an XML import?

Don’t try to adjust them. Delete them, select the note only, then Shift-comma. I’m almost positive they’ll look right.

[jgg]

Thanks Dan, but it doesn’t help in this case. The project started from a Cubase .mid file, but all the dynamics markings (and lots more) were done in Dorico. I selected the note/notes, and selected the hairpin from the RH dynamics panel. That obviously does the same thing as Shift-comma. No difference. Incidentally, in your video, when the hairpin is selected, there’s a diagonal orange line on the right showing that the hairpin is aligned to a point in the next bar (the rest bar). That line ends at the same place in my project, but it’s a vertical line, because the hairpin goes right up to that point.

Attached is a pic showing what happens if I put a system break just before the last bar. The hairpin ends at the barline end-of-system as expected - nothing carries on to the next system. Obviously, I’d like that behaviour to happen when the hairpin is within the system.

I know how to shorten the hairpin, thanks Derek, but I don’t really want to do it throughout the whole score.

Is it a quirk of 2.2, perhaps?

John.

[rafaelv]

In Engraving options/Dynamics/Gradual Dynamics open the Advanced options dropdown menu, find “Hairpins ending at beggining of note at start of bar” and chosse Do not cross barline
I think that should do it.

Regards
Rafael

[jgg]

That’s it! Thanks so much, Rafaelv.

However, let me point out to the developers that the hairpin did NOT end “at beginning of note at start of bar”. Because there’s no note at the start of the next bar in my example. So, you wouldn’t expect that option to have any effect.

In other words, if you select a note that ends at the end of a bar, and put a hairpin on it, you would NEVER want the hairpin to extend past the barline if there is a rest following.

John.

[pianoleo]

Yes and no, John. If you’d had a crescendo to an actual note in another instrument (at the same time as the crescendi to rests), it could look ambiguous if the crescendi to nowhere stop before the crescendo to a note. As such, if you have the Engraving Option set to end hairpins at the beginning of note at start of bar, Dorico aligns the end of the hairpin at the beginning of the note in any stave at the start of the next bar.

If you don’t like this, either turn off the Engraving Option or adjust the barline continuation property locally (in the bottom panel)

[jgg]

Mmm, I appreciate the response, Leo. But I’m having trouble agreeing that the behaviour I experienced is acceptable at any time, regardless of what is happening in other staves. As Dan pointed out, it just looks wrong! And I think it would still look wrong in your example.