help, how can I get this dotted 1/4 note ? measure in 4/4.
Use force duration (letter o) when inputting the dotted quarter tied to the eighth triplet.
If itās already entered and not showing as you need, chances are you will need to untie those notes, select the quarter, press o, 5, 66. Force duration on the 8th note too, then tie them (T).
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I tried everything.
with untied notes, I can have the dotted c. but when I manually tie the tuplet 1/8 to the dotted 1/4 it transforms into 1/4+1/8ā¦
Thatās why I told you to force duration on the triplet 8th. Tied notes inherit the āforce durationā status of the notes inside the tie-chain. Make sure theyāre all forced or the result wonāt be what you expect (really follow my last advice).
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forced duration on tuplet 1/8, do Not tie, forced duration and dot on 1/4, then Tie the notes.
yes there it was.
thank you so much !!
Joakim Sandgren
this is way to complicated just to put an extremely simple and common suite of notesā¦
this must be a parameter somewhere, I have chosen all the āhalf-note over the middle of the measureā etcā¦ but I still have this over and overā¦!
I start to input all notes without ties and then come back and tie themā¦
this canāt be the idea of how to do thisā¦? in 3/4.
the thing is that all this works perfectly in
but is completely impossible in
but if you input notes with a midi keyboard and use ābefore inputting noteā you loose the possibility to adjust enharmonic spellings like c-sharp/d-flat that always occure with a midi keyboard so that is not a solution either !
I agree with you.
Thatās one of the little things thatās unbearable in Dorico. Like many others users, Iād like it to write a dotted quarter note when you type a dotted quarter note on the keyboard, and stop interfering with what you want. Weāre old enough to decide what note value we want to enter, regardless of pseudo-engraving rules that you donāt find in publishers like Henle, Schott or Barenreiter ; are they bad publishers ?
I hope that, in future versions of the software, this Ā« automatic correction Ā» will disappear completely, so that we can behave as freely as in any other softwares. 
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Iād input those as dotted minims, rather than handling the ties yourself - if you have force duration active from the start, it should work? Admittedly Iāve not tried that myself.
Or, add a (hidden, if needed) 6/8 time signature here, either for all staves or just this one. That will result in notes being grouping into dotted crotchets (to match the 6/8 meter).
dotted 1/2s gives me this :
a dotted 1/2 true, but mostly it is the first case with a small note bound to a dotted note.
but why doesnāt opt-shift-right do the job ??
I have these options marked, it should be a dotted 1/4 at least when I do opt-shift-right no ?
if not Iād propose that we add an option to cover this case.
an option to have a dotted 1/4 after a tie when opt-shift-right.
opt-shift-right does the job when itās a tied dotted 1/8ā¦
Right yes, even with Force Duration, entering a dotted minim in 3/4 doesnāt result in two tied dotted crotchets (which admittedly is reasonable, given the implied meter of a 3/4 time signature).
If you have Force Duration active, in 3/4, and enter a dotted crotchet followed by lengthening the note using Shift-Alt-Right arrow, you do get a pair of dotted crotchets. You donāt if Force Duration wasnāt already active before you started lengthening, because then the new note duration simply follows note grouping options, as normal.
Iām not sure about adding options for this in 3/4, when if the meter you want to imply is 6/8, that ability already exists (for you to enter a 6/8 time signature, either globally or locally, and hide it if you want).
hm, I canāt reproduce the force duration dotted 1/4 lengthened by shift-opt-rightā¦ I get 1/4+1/8ā¦ I start in the middle of the 3/4 barā¦
the hidden 6/8 isnāt a solution because all other parts are well in 3/4. this is 3/4 and this is the counter guyā¦
and, Iām copying several different composers lately, and they all do this kind of stuff, tied dotted 1/2, tied dotted 1/4 over the middle, or start on a off 1/8 positionā¦ etc
itās a common situation
and again this works with ābefore inputting noteā but I canāt use that because then I loose the possibility to respell notes (input with midi keyboard).
Are you starting with the existing dotted quarter already having Force Duration activated, as I specified?
You can give a time signature to one staff only, as Iāve already mentioned. More information here:
Yes, thatās what independent time signatures, the ability to specify beat grouping as part of a time signature (eg [2+3+2]/8), Notation Options, and Force Duration are all set up to cater for.
For situations that really either arenāt possible to produce even using those options, or that are very tricky, the team are interested to hear about for future consideration. However, here, I think a hidden independent 6/8 time signature will very easily and neatly solve your problems for you.
yes I have force duration on from the start.
how do you lengthen ? I try with 1/8 grid and even dotted 1/4 grid.
changing the meter is more complicated and even more job than to input without ties and then tie them afterwards. and it complicates the file, and in the music itās only here and there. thereās absolutely no logic in changing meter for these passagesā¦ sorry
I think the fact that it doesnāt make a dotted 1/4 using shift-opt-right is the culprit. there is where it should be possibleā¦ with an option like the ones we already haveā¦
itās actually quite strangeā¦ where does it say that a dotted 1/4 is absolutely a 1/4+1/8 ? whereās the rule ? in engraver options ? or perhaps notation optionsā¦ ? have I clicked an option where I āchoseā this ? without knowing ?
joakim
Trying to learn Dorico myself by seeing if I can reproduce some of the presented solutions.
After I found out how to create a Time Signature for just one staff by shift-M 6/8 Alt/Opt Enter and hiding it in the properties panel, you actually can enter those notes as dotted 1/2 notes to get this
well first you need to look for the end of this rhythms in the score, and then put a 3/4 there (that will stop the 6/8).
then you go back to the start and put a 6/8 in the first measure.
than you open properties and hit hide for both of them.
and now, you can go back into input mode and start to put notesā¦
Itās just much faster to input the notes with force duration without ties and then just tie them manually.
and it saves me from a lot of possibilities to do something wrong with music already inputted, later in the pieceā¦
joakim
I think that the keys we use should have some meaning.
If I hit dot, it should be a dot, and not a 1/4+1/8, because I asked for a dot.
If I want a 1/4+1/8 I use shift-option-right-arrow.
joakim
Joakim,
There have been many, many threads about this strange behaviour, especially since the MakeMusic offer has brought former Finale users to Dorico.
It seems that the Notations Options arenāt working as they should and that this is due to a bug, a bug that weāre currently having to get round by doing some impossible pirouettes. So letās wait and see whether the development team fixes it soon or not.
See this thread
and, especially the answer of Daniel Spreadbury, six days ago :
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Oh ! ?? so it will be fixedā¦ ?
itās perfect then. .
phew.
very good
Iāll happily pirouetting until thenā¦
thanks for info !
joakim
For what itās worth, when Iāve handled this style of music before (with different combinations of players in 6/8 vs 3/4, and for different chunks of music) I found it easier to work left-to-right and just add time signatures as I went.
Seeing lots of ties show up in bars was an easy visual indicator that it might be time to switch the meter.
Because Dorico re spells rhythms dynamically, thereās no harm in doing it this way rather than adding the āstopperā time signature later first. Thatās really just a matter of personal preference.
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hm, I always setup the entire score structure / meter etc with the first part I write (like fl1). and then re iterate part by part.
and I really try not to dabble too much with the score structure afterwards, with individual meters and stuff.
Itās barley I can use the Insert mode without leaving the whole score in shamblesā¦
Iāll do the manual tieā¦
joakim