Hyphen spacing at start of system

I often have problems adjusting the hyphen at the start of a system. It’ll jump around randomly between mouse dragging and Alt-arrows. Eventually I can get it in the right place, but it feels like alchemy when I do. Is there a setting I’m not understanding?

Here’s just one example: the final system, first syllable, “-sus.” https://www.dropbox.com/s/ouuyqe6c3sthvpr/This%20Is%20My%20Fathers%20World_STW.dorico?dl=0

There’s something not quite right here. Provided the lyric at the start of the system doesn’t coincide rhythmically with the start of the system, dragging it left or right adjusts its position in the way i would expect, but if the lyric is at the start of the system, those edits have no effect. We’ll look into this.

Thanks Daniel! Overall, typesetting hymns in Dorico has been an incredibly pleasant experience. Working on a massive 450-hymn project right now and loving it.

FWIW, I’ve experienced the same thing in multiple projects. A slight nudge and suddenly the hyphen hits some invisible threshold and jumps rather than continuing to move smoothly by small increments. I wonder in this case if it has anything to do with how the calculations factor in when it’s time for a second hyphen. I know the settings in this project mean that it would be necessary to stretch the handle quite far before a second hyphen is introduced, but if you carefully watch how they jump around and reposition when there are two, it appears to me to be the same motion but with a single hyphen. (Hopefully this makes sense. To phrase it differently: when a second hyphen is required, the first hyphen jumps a bit to properly accommodate the second. It is this type of jumping to which I’m referring.)

Update: I did find a way around this.

  1. Drag the hyphen where you want it, release, and the hyphen jumps back to hug the syllable.
  2. Select the syllable, and nudge it slightly in either direction. Hyphen will jump to the spot you had put it.
  3. Repeat 1 and 2 as needed.

Seems convoluted to me. I expect this to be automatic… Hopefully in an update ?

I had this problem yesterday and unfortunately I couldn’t get it where I wanted it because of the jumping (perhaps “snapping” is a better term) behavior your gif excellently demonstrates.

Did my workaround work for you?

Just to say that my colleague Andrew has fixed this problem today, and you will be able to adjust hyphens preceding a lyric on the first note of the system in the next update.

Thanks Daniel! Will this affect hyphen spacing changes that I’ve made to existing files?

Great, thanks Andrew and Daniel! And I wish you a very happy new year!

I’m not sure, is the short answer. It may.

So glad to hear this.

Dan, to answer your question, I hadn’t seen your solution in time. I’ll mention that it was complicated by the fact that I had shifted the “columns” of the first notes on staves 2, 3, 4 to get the verse numbers to line up, which was also messing with things… I really hope that issue gets addressed soon too. I can’t stand it when the verse numbers are different on every line. (First line = ok due to key signature)

Along these lines, does anyone know of any conventions that would inform how much space should be placed between the hyphen and the first syllable? Gould doesn’t comment on it.

(This is admittedly not a Dorico question, per se.)

I’m wondering if this has been fixed with a setting I’m unfamiliar with. See attached, where the hyphen collides with the lyric, maybe somehow related to the time signature?

Hopefully there’s a setting to take care of this kind of thing?hyphen

It has not yet been fixed, but the development team is aware of the problem.