In Italian "Coda" is feminine, therefore...

Not trying to dismember your argument, but being a native Spanish speaker I can say that “coda” is not even a word in Spanish. And I’m afraid that “seño” also suffers the same fate, since it is not a word in Spanish either (at least not with the meaning of the Italian “segno”). The Spanish words for “coda” and “segno” are: “cola” and “signo”, the first being feminine and the second masculine.

Yes, it seems that a lot of people have found this topic interesting. Being a fluent Italian speaker (I’ve been living in Rome for four years now, and I spoke Italian even before that), I can say that “al Coda” suona veramente brutto! I think it’s one of those things that need to be fixed and not continue a mistake made by editors and composers that did not speak Italian.

Also, contrary to what others in the discussion have said, I have failed to find a score by an Italian publishing house that says “al Coda”.

1 Like

Sono completamente d’accordo che ‘al coda’ sa di una bruttezza, una vera dissonanza, tremenda.

Non è proprio ‘sbagliato’, però, se lo/la (!) si scrive così per via del fatto che mancano le parole ‘segno della’!

Also, contrary to what others in the discussion have said, I have failed to find a score by an Italian publishing house that says “al Coda”.

Ma hai pure un esempio di una casa editrice che ha ‘alla coda’?

1 Like

I’m afraid I must disagree, since 1st it does exist as a variation of “ceño”, see for example “Así veía a su rededor como si buscara a alguien que la salvara de su tribulación y fruncía el seño. - Antonio Domínguez Hidalgo” or "desabrochó el justillo, alzó el pañuelo de vivos colores que se cruzaba sobre su seño de Cibeles, y metiendo en la boquita del ángel lo que éste más deseaba, volvió a cubrirse con tanto recato como si delante de un regimiento se encontrase. - Emilia Pardo Bazán :smiley:

I don’t know where you are from, but in South America it’s certainly used in the vernacular “el seño y la coda”, whether or not these are officially in the Spanish Dictionary of the Royal Academy of the Spanish Language is another matter… I have never heard the word “cola” used to refer to a Coda, I have occasionally heard “signo” to refer to the “seño”, but it’s sometimes frowned upon by snobs… :laughing:

¡Hola de nuevo! Soy de México. ¿Tú de dónde eres?

Respecto a los ejemplos que mencionas, me parece que no están relacionados con el tema, ya que citas usos de la palabra que en español tiene una acepción absolutamente diferente. Los casos que mencionas — que además “ceño” se escribe con “c” y no con “s” — claramente usan tal vocablo como sinónimo de entrecejo o frente, y no guarda relación alguna con el italiano que, en este caso, se traduciría al español simple y sencillamente como “signo”.

Dentro de la profesión musical, claro que se usan segno y coda. A través de su uso tan particular en la música, inclusive “coda” se ha incorporado dentro del idioma y para eso solo hay que revisar el Diccionario de la Lengua Española. Sin embargo, insisto en que el uso de la palabra dentro del contexto de una frase en italiano deba guardar su género y los usos apropiados del idioma.

¡Saludos!

Si por supesto estimado, solo estaba siendo… Hmmm, no se cual es la palbra en castellano pero quiero decir “facetious”. Ya que decias que la palabra no existe. Era solo broma. Soy de Ingalterra pero vivi muchisimos años en Chile y tengo familia ahi… Claro, tambien esta el echo que los chilenos hablan terrible castellano :laughing:

Ah! O sea Coda aparece en el diccionario? Pues no lo sabia! Usando tu mismo argumento y creo que ya se hecho el caso aqui, Coda se refiere al signo no a la cola como la llamas tu. Buscando un poco por internet no logro encontrar mas que el echo que “alla Coda” a penas se ocupa en italiano y es rarisimo en otros idiomas. Si he logrado encontrar varias conversaciones entre italianos al respecto y parece ser que la conclusion es la misma, es porque “Al” se feriere al signo no a la cola: Da capo al coda - Cruscate

No es mi culpa! (Google’s fault :wink: ) :laughing:

Simple experiment…

:cry: :cry: :cry:
My people… yes, many of them talk terrible…


But, see: I challenge you to find three errors in your sentence.

“Claro, también está el hecho…”
What did I win?

My congratulations, of course.

Damn! I should’ve picked up on the “Echo” I always get them confused… Also the haya/halla/alla, I’m worthless! As for the accents I don’t know how to do them on a PC, on my phone I can. Not that internet forums are a place where grammar and spelling rules are observed… :wink:

Don’t worry. Here half (being optimistic) of the native speakers write “echo” this way, too. A give you a tip: as “hecho” is participle of “hacer” (and the noun “hecho”, derived from it) you can remember the word “fact”. Indeed, fact and hecho are brothers, they have the same root. Hacer in Latin: facere. Italian fare. Just that in Spanish the f mutated to h in many words (but not in all).
As “echo” means “I throw something, I put some ingredient” (but too with a “de menos” in “te echo de menos” means “I miss you”) has no h, you can’t confuse them now.

But we are a little OT here. :blush:

Ha! Brilliant! Yes that’s good tip, if I give them enough thought I usually get it right, but I rarely write in Spanish, barring my nephews…

Just for the record, I think it’s truly commendable that @Bollen speaks Spanish. Little spelling mistakes are made by native speakers all the time and accents are almost never used in forums, SMS and emails (laziness if not anything else — although that sometimes leads to interesting sentences that might mean completely different things than intended). Anyways, my intent was never to make fun of @Bollen or take away from the praise due from speaking a foreign language.

Going back to my original intention: I was only trying to let the team at Dorico know that maybe they should at least consider adding in this matter of the Coda a few more options or the possibility for us to customise our own text for the Coda features. They’ve done this in wonderful ways in other matters where there are diverging opinions. I understand there’s other priorities, though, that are most high up the list of to-dos for them.

It’s been a pleasure speaking to all of you!