I have looked through other topics, but trying to follow the instructions isn’t quite getting what I need.
I have an arrangement that I’ve decided needs a pickup measure of 1 quarter note in my introduction. I’ve tried different ways to add this quarter note pickup without shifting the music that follows, but I can’t figure out what I’m doing wrong.
If I try to turn the first measure into the pickup measure it shifts the following entries forward 1 beat. If I create a new blank measure at the beginning of the arrangement and make that a 1 beat pickup the entries that follow shift also.
What do I need to do to simply add a blank pickup bar to the music without having to edit the entries that follow?
Add a cautionary time signature at the beginning of the second measure (if you put it in parentheses in the popover, it will be automatically hidden).
Remove the appropriate number of beats from the first measure via Shift+B (in this case, three quarter notes, since I set the main TS to 4/4 and want a pickup of one quarter note).
For context, I’m a Finale refugee. At this point, I wish I had switched over sooner, I think Dorico works better. However, the rational for how Dorico programmed the pickups to work in this way is confusing to me. From reading through topics here I note that there are usually reasons why Dorico is set up to work in these ways, but I don’t understand why in this case. Can anyone offer the overall rational for why it shifts the rhythms when adding it the way I was before? It would help me come to a better understanding on how I need to adjust my work flow compared with Finale.
I am also a Finale refugee, and this topic is one of the things I would like to understand better. There are quite a few threads about it on the forum.
I initially learned a sort of similar method, but instead of removing beats, you were supposed to enter the time signature of the pickup measure. However, this method requires an extra step since you then have to delete a measure between the pickup one and the next one (see below). I would love to understand this better too!
Maybe someone more experienced can clarify this or suggest another method.
But in this case one is adding a pickup measure to pre-existing music. From the point of view of starting at the beginning, the pickup approach is not an issue.
Now I realize that many Finale alumni are porting XML files over, so this has become (perhaps) a hotter topic than it was heretofore.
At least the Dorico approach allows one to send a repeat to the start of a file with a pickup without the gap Finale used to impose if one used their original pickup-measure routine.
I have actually never worked yet with imported xml files, since I first want to understand as much as possible how Dorico behaves on its own from the scratch.
In this case, what confuses ex-Finale users is that Finale allowed you to insert a measure anywhere, with any TS/number of beats, without interfering with the already existing music.
I understand (and really appreciate!) the way Dorico handles rythm in general, but I still don’t perfectly understand why e.g. Insert Mode (with possibly the stop red line) does not allow you to easily insert an empty mesure with a different TS in the middle of the existing music.
It is indeed possible at the end, but with more steps that what we are used to.
As someone who began using Finale from its very first version, I understand what you mean. I suspect (although of course I do not know anything about the Dorico back end or source code) that Finale’s ability to spoof time signatures worked well with Finale’s measure-oriented organization whereas Dorico does not organize its musical information by measure, rather in a way that gives Dorico much more fluidity to recast time signatures and measures on the fly.
I am willing to take a few extra steps for the sake of this flexibility, but in the future Dorico may find a way to reproduce the Finale approach. At thOn the other hand the Dorico Team might argue that Finale’s approach does not fall in line with the semantic approach at the heart of the current Dorico concept.
It’s the “…without interfering with the already existing music” that confuses me. Inserting a bar (of rests) does interfere, always. Inserting a barline (anywhere) does not.
Add to that the uncertainty of whether you are inserting that (empty space) in just one voice, one instrument or across the whole score… (Dorico can do all of them, and each by more than one route)… and any answer will appear to be complicated (or not what you wanted)…
I’m not quite following this. When I add a pickup measure why does this change the following rhythms? It seems as if I add a measure and set the time signature as “4/4, 1” Dorico assumes that I still need those 4 beats and just pushes everything that follows back to keep those extra three beats I don’t want. Is there a particular reason why someone would want to do so that I’m not considering?
If you want a rest in the pick-up, you must add musical time (you can use the shift-B bars popover)… Here I select where to insert, and enter shift-B 1q (which adds 1 beat)
There are other ways you could achieve this (eg. Select the notes and use alt-right arrow to move them) - but that would only affect this one instrument and you might want to shift everything in the score.
To use Dorico effectively I think it is essential you get comfortable with this concept (and also how things change with each of the different insert modes). Experimentation is the best way to learn.
Blockquote To use Dorico effectively I think it is essential you get comfortable with this concept (and also how things change with each of the different insert modes). Experimentation is the best way to learn.
Thanks for the explanation, that does help me better understand how Dorico handles time signatures. I still don’t fully understand why it does it in this way, as I don’t find the way it redistributes rhythms to be helpful in any way for the way I work, but I agree that it’s important to get comfortable with how it works.
Blockquote If you want a rest in the pick-up, you must add musical time (you can use the shift-B bars popover)… Here I select where to insert, and enter shift-B 1q (which adds 1 beat)
Hey! Please note that in my example I first added the extra beat (which you need, of course, since the music is now 1 beat longer!), and then I adjusted the bar and time signature, so that the extra beat is now contained in the pick-up bar. I find it more logical that way, but everyone is different, of course!
(Still thinking about it, sorry!)
I feel like this method may bring some issues if, for any reason, you had to use Force Duration somewhere in the already entered music. When testing with this example, I lose the forced notations if, at a point in the process, the beats move from their original place (i.e cross a barline).
As I said in both earlier posts, there are usually many different routes to do something. Each route may have consequences. All we can do is offer some suggestions. We cannot second-guess the precise circumstances of every enquiry.
