Intelligently convert 4/4 to 12/8 by properly reinterpreting note durations

Hi, all. I’m using Dorico Pro 5, and am a relatively new user. After reading the existing two posts on this topic in this forum, I am surprised to find that there is no easy way to convert a block of 4/4 measures with eighth-note triplets to 12/8. This is trivial for most DAW’s, including mine (MOTU DP): basically, all note durations that correspond to an eighth-note triplet in 4/4 get reinterpreted as an eighth note in the new 12/8 measures. This would crucially include quarter notes, which are three eighth-note triplets in 4/4 and become dotted quarters in the re-interpreted 12/8 time signature, and half notes, which becomes two tied dotted quarters or a dotted half note, since they are the equivalent of six eighth-note triplets in the original 4/4 time signature.

Is such a meter change with reinterpreting existing note durations possible in Dorico 5? Am I missing something? I get that by default Dorico does not at all reinterpret any note durations when changing meters, which is useful (I suppose) in some situations, but it should at a minimum have the option to do note length reinterpretation.

I thought I could get what I want with the Write->Edit Duration submenu, but it does not offer the kind of control needed here, where I’d want to say “take every eighth note triplet and convert to eighth note, and do this consistently across all note durations in my selection”.

Welcome to the forum, Dan. Indeed, there is no “one stop shop” feature for achieving this kind of edit in Dorico, I’m afraid. You can do it in a few steps, though: make sure Insert mode is activated, and then delete the triplet brackets one by one. This will un-scale the notes inside the tuplet, and provided Insert mode is active, this will prevent them from overwriting subsequent notes.

Thanks for the very prompt reply! But won’t all quarter and half notes in the 4/4 time signature still be incorrect in this procedure? As far as I can tell, by deleting triplet brackets with Insert mode turned on, you only will affect notes explicitly marked as triplets, which would not include quarter and half notes, which are worth three triplet eighth notes tied together but are not notated that way. The procedure you describe would leave any notes not notated as triplets alone, correct?

Correct. For them, you’d need to select each of them and make them dotted.

Okay, thanks, understood. And still further editing would be required if you have a triplet eighth note that is tied to a quarter or half note in the 4/4 meter. I believe each of these situations would need to be edited by hand (i.e., there is no way to select all such notes and re-notate their durations in one fell swoop).

I realize there are probably 10,000 new features being requested right now, esp. with the “mass migration” of former Finale users (which is a good thing!), but I’m going to put in a feature request for a meter change dialog box (or equivalent), such that your meter change applies to the current selection of notes, and where you can explicitly specify a duration in the old meter and what it will equal in the new meter, and all note durations get adjusted.

Again, I realize this is one of thousands of feature requests (my day job is as a software engineer and AI research scientist), but I believe it would save people a lot of time once implemented, and the fact that it already exists in multiple DAW’s suggests it would have broad enough application across users.

Most of all, I really appreciate how much attention you are paying to this message board! That is true dedication.

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Alternatively, beefing up the fuctionality of the Write->Edit Duration feature would also be sufficient here, where you could specify how you want durations to be stretched or compressed, and all durations would change accordingly in the current selection.

This kind of duration editing has of course been requested before, and it’s on our (endless) backlog for future implementation.

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Hi, again. I’m hoping that any new duration editing features will have the DAW-like ability to preserve tempo. E.g., suppose you have a section of music at quarter note = 100 bpm in 4/4 time with eighth-note triplets, and you want to convert all that to 12/8. The user should have the option to say how to alter tempo markings to preserve the tempo after transforming durations. In this case, the new tempo might be specified as a dotted quarter = 100 bpm, or even a dotted half note = 50 bpm and the overall tempo would be preserved.

Can you point me to the existing feature request for a more robust duration editing feature?

I can’t without searching the forum, no, but fortunately the tools to search the forum are available to you as well :slight_smile:

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