I came from Finale. Once I got a hang of Dorico, I started to like this program. It has many more additional functions. So far, the only function I have issue with is the Transpose tool. I never had this issue with Finale. With Dorico, so far, I had no problem transposing pieces that have one key. I have this issue only with multiple key compositions.
In the attached Dorico file, you can’t transpose this entire piece by half note up or down. Imagine I realized that two of my compositions can be combined to make one better piece of music. I am so excited. But Dorico can’t transpose either of the pieces. Then I have to rewrite one piece, the melody, the harmonies, proof reading afterwards which is prone to mistakes and time consuming. One of the reasons we rely on notation softwares.
I remember I read a discussion about this issue many months before, one user explained that the target key was not available which was the reason the calculation tool was greyed out or the direct selection was not available. I am not good at music theory. I couldn’t offer my counter argument at that time. Now I think, at the end of the day, I can start a song at any point on the chromatic scale. I can start it on C or I can start it on B. If this statement is true. Why Dorico grey out some of the options?
Dorico will not transpose into a key that produces key signatures with double-sharps or double-flats in them. You will need to transpose such sections into the enharmonic equivalents.
Thanks for the response.
I just Googled it. The Google AI answer is:
Yes, B sharp (B#) is enharmonically equivalent to C natural (C). This means they sound the same and occupy the same key on a piano. The term “enharmonic” refers to notes that sound the same but are written differently.
Does a song in key B# sound the same as the song in key C? If they sound the same. Why can’t Dorico put the song in B# or C?
When you are coming from Finale, this is indeed frustrating. But the Dorico team is aware of it and will likely do something about it! It’s been discussed here many times, and the they read all the messages.
Meanwhile, it is of course possible to transpose an entire piece with multiple key signatures — but in your case, you need to separate some sections that don’t require the same kind of transposition than the others.
For example, to transpose everything by a semitone dowbn, you could do the first four sections like this: A>G#, D>C#, G>F#, C>B. For the sixth section: Bb>A. But for the fifth section, G#>F## is not possible — since F## minor doesn’t exist (fortunately!). So instead you’ll need to do G#>Gnat, which technically isn’t the same transposition. In the first cases, it’s a minor second (different note names), and in the last case it’s an augmented unison (same note name, different accidental).
A feature that would do all this automatically would also need to make choices — or ask us to make them — between enharmonic keys like F#/Gb major, G#/Ab minor, C#/Db major, etc…
Just tried >>> G minor (with the “Simplifier les tonalités si nécessaire” option checked - must be Simplify KS if needed or something like that in English). Without, it creates a weird F## KS!
That would be a welcome addition to Dorico too.
Maybe something popping up to give you that choice - once it is necessary. That seems to be a better choice than to leave the poor users scratching their heads, thinking something isn’t working - or worse “I have made a mistake”…
Thanks, guys, for your kind response.
Here is what I did. I pulled out the wheel of fifths. It has 12 keys that match every half note of the chromatic scale. I transposed this score by half note one key at a time:
A to Bb
D to D#
G to G#
C to C#
G# to A
Bb to B
Dorico did not give any resistance. But refuses to do it at once.
From what I see from the comments, the issue is the augmented unison and minor second. Are they not the same? The same is double sharp or flat. C double sharp is D. Correct me if I am wrong. Like I said before, let’s keep the discussion simple. I can start a song at any point of the chromatic scale. There is a key at any point of the chromatic scale. Finale puts it there. But Dorico doesn’t.
I see, at last, you guys agree that Dorico needs to do something about it instead of leaving people hanging.
No, they are not. They are enharmonically the same – same key on a piano – but they are technically different intervals. And when it comes to transposition, they have different implications in terms of the key signatures and transposed pitches.
Being the same key on the piano keyboard doesn’t mean they’re the same. “Enharmonic equivalent” is a bit of a misnomer, as they’re not actually equivalent in many important ways. A perfect fifth above B is F-sharp, not G-flat (diminished sixth). A minor second above E-flat is F-flat, not E-natural (augmented unison).
When I teach music fundamentals at my university, I avoid the phrase “enharmonic equivalent” and instead say “enharmonically related” or something similar.
In fact, F# and Gb may be the same keystroke on a piano, however, on a string instrument (or with singers), the intonation can differ considerably, depending on tonal context. On my cello, in first position on the D string, the visible difference between F# and Gb can be roughly a centimetre. It’s not just theoretical.
Wow. This is new. If that is the case, then there is a serious problem. A same written notes sounds different on two instruments. Equal temperament is defined as one octave is divided into 12 equal parts.
Equal temperament has not really been used before 1850, because it’s quite out of tune in quite a number of intervals! You might want to read about temperaments in music
Fortunately (or not… it’s a lifelong struggle, believe me) we can adjust intonation on string instruments. Subtleties like I describe occur when you’re playing e.g. string quartet, where everybody has the same control of relative intonation. Introducing a pianist to the game makes a lot of difference. Then, you’ll have to adjust to the equal temperament. Perfectly possible, just different.
