Life in old IK Multimedia Products?

Cubase
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As a new user of Cubase Pro 15 I’m still a bit overwhelmed with all the features, but I got Pro because I want all the modern fancy toys combined within.
Where as I’m new to DAWs, albeit trying Cubase 2 a long time ago, I’m a vet of Humble Bundle dot com, so the latest software bundle from IK Multimedia that’s on there right now raised an interested eyebrow.

I can only guess how useful these plugins would be, but if they are as old as the Sample Tank 4 that’s included, will they be obsolete compared to what I already have with Cubase Pro ?
Likewise, I’ve seen a few posts about compatibility “issues/features” with Sample Tank 4 and Cubase, but again, is this really an obsolete 6 year old pack that has been superseded with products like HALion or still a valid and useful product to add to my repository, especially at this bundle price ? It’s only 27 quid, but I’d rather ask for a bit of advice first please.

(PS why do the Steinberg forums give a spellcheck error for “HALion” ??:zany_face: )

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“HALion”, good one, I’ve never noticed :laughing:

I am not familiar with IK products but you sure get a lot with Cubase Pro. I’m sure someone else can give you a more detailed answer.

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It’s a good question, but it’s also a tough question because there are a LOT of factors as to why someone might or might not want to use a certain plugin. I’ve got a bunch of IK Multimedia plugins so I’ll just try to be fair and say that, subjectively, I think several of them are very good, right up there with some of the upper-tier competition. HOWEVER, more importantly, and after years of owning them, I find I DON’T ACTUALLY USE them very often… and in fact most of my projects don’t have a single one of them. And sometimes I wonder why I even installed them. Take that for what you will, and that might sound very harsh, but stay with me for a moment as I explain a little more…

That’s why this is a tough question because there is SO much subjectivity involved, and also my own preferences, biases, and workflows that I’m used to over many years. And to be frank, I have a massive plugin library. Way too big, and it’s distracting! And now I am planning on downsizing which ones I install. HOWEVER, in all fairness, if ALL I had was IK Multimedia plugins, I’m sure I could make excellent stuff. BUT again, I think we are so fortunate for having so many good plugins these days, that I’d say that about many developers.

So let me put this another way: I suggest you focus on learning all the plugins that come with Cubase first, get used to them, learn your preferences for what is important to you, and over time you’ll figure out where your gaps are and what you might need to fill those gaps.

The plugins that come with Cubase Pro 15 are very good, will take you far, and you really have what you need to make great music already. Steinberg has covered a lot of bases to start out. Your imagination is really the only limitation. DON’T just rush to buy new third-party plugins because they are cheap or on sale or bundled with some big special package, especially if they are older plugins that haven’t been updated/maintained in a while, just because it’s a good deal. But rather, buy plugins deliberately, thoughtfully, with purpose, because you WANT or NEED to use them and you think they will add something valuable to your productions. There will ALWAYS be more DEALS in the future, so don’t feel rushed to get stuff now. And BTW, I wish I followed my own advice in the past, but I ended up buying way more plugins than I needed over many many years. Learn from my mistakes!

Over time you’ll know what you need… and perhaps then you’ll jump in with IK Multimedia OR perhaps not! And maybe you’ll find something else. There are tons of great options out there! So take your time, buy deliberately, focused, with specific results in mind, and you’ll be far better off in the long run.

I know that’s a bit nebulous, but hopefully that helps a little.

Just my two bits. YMMV.

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The worst thing with IKM is that they’re constantly trying to sell you stuff - products are full of presets for plugins you don’t own.
I have SampleTank 4 MAX, Syntronik Deluxe, Syntronik 2,SampleTron 2, AmpliTube 4 and 5,
T-RackS 5 MAX and the Hammond B3. But only Amplitube 4, the B3, and T-Racks are installed, and only the B3 gets used.

I prefer HALion, Plugin Alliance amps, and UA’s Waterfall/Lesley.
If you like mellotrons, get the samples made by the RedTron guy and load them into HALion (not Sonic!).

Make of all that what you will.

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I use the B3X organ exclusively, as it is the best Hammond emulation available as far as I am concerned, and it is approved by the original hardware makers.

I did use SampleTank but I stopped because many of the instruments weren’t properly in range, and I substituted UVI Falcon instead, as a ROMPler.

One exception, is the Trilian bass module, although you can go out of range, we are talking bass so replicating with real instruments, may well be easier, than say a guitar tuned to low D, which for those I use Ample Sound due to their realistic sound and chord tools.

Synth (emulations) of course, is Arturia, GForce and Cherry Audio, and Piano is the Spitfire composers piano. There is a new Electric Piano called WurlyBird, which negates any need for a (software) ROMPler in my view.

Orchestral stuff, would be VSL but that is too expensive for me and when you look at a library there is always something missing, for example tuned percussion; there is no vibraphone so that is rather unhelpful ,as much as I want to get onboard with those sounds.

For drums I use ToonTrack, as well as for percussion. d16 is for drum machines, and Roland I use for percussion synths.

There are so many really good sounds available, these days that I can finally say that I believe hardware to be obsolete, at least for composition purposes but I would use hardware, if I could afford it, with Steinberg DAW’s at the centre of my studio.

I doubt I will change anything, unless the boundaries of realism can be pushed further.

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the installer is a nightmare - the FX are good but I steer clear of the synths . They sound good but not worth the hassle IMHO

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Hi,
I have been with Cubase since 1993, each year it get’s more complicated, I have recently started re-learning Cubase, as I have only done basics since Cubase 5. I can appreciate there is a lot of lerning required.
Here is what I am doing. I focus on one (useful) cubase idea at a time. I do a test track, just for getting muscle memory going, I do a utube binge and read the manual. Yesterday I did the project zone - real basic stuff. But what I wanted to achieve is to prove to myself, that every button, every change off appearance, every tool, every right click menu was understood, by me WITH muscle memory goto clickiklickyness. This might take a day or two. Learn the important Windows in Cubase and the right click menus.
Depending on your genre you need different tools. House might require Sampler Tracks, Orchestral notation, rock audio… I think everyone needs a fluency in the Project Window and the Key Editor, to a degree comparible with one finger typing at speed.
Spend your time learning these windows. As for fx, well they are everywhere, you fly by the seat of your pants. I am exaggerating here but sometimes it can feel like you walk into a parrot shop, knowing only the word parrot and a vague idea, and the shop offers you 1345 parrot classifications classified by Parrot song, to drill down thoough. The trick is to accept this is always the case and avoid wandering, focus on the basics and get these running well.
If you put even one note into a Sampler Track, then you can get out a symphony, youtube Dom Siglasi. Although you should have an understand Media Bay, there are rabbit warrens there.
The mission critical thing is to focus on your needs and master the basic windows. Make sure you have a proper understanding of MIDI and basic automation. You already have enough plugins for a career. Sampole Tank 4 is obsolete. With Cubase there are many toys from a full orchestra, to free synths, you defintely do not need to go shopping yet.

Just IMO

Z

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I had a look at the bundle… all the products in there seem to be currently supported products from IK. Whether they are useful to you is another thing.

The Sampletank library is hit and miss, probably all of it useful in some way, but the better stuff are additional paid extensions. Imho probably not necessary if there is Halion Sonic and lots of free stuff around (you can get “complete” orchestra samples for free these days…).

Tonex SE is definitely way better than anything Cubase has to offer regarding amp simulations, as is MODO bass. Not sure about MODO drums and Pianoverse.

The Effects are usually very good, but probably not a necessity if one is just starting out with Cubase.

IK have a tendency though to release new major versions every couple of years which you have to pay for. You don’t need to buy them, the old ones will still work, but they become officially unsupported. Not a major issue, just something to be aware of

I agree though with the other posts here that especially in the beginning, it is not useful to overload yourself with too many choices. “Option paralysis” is a thing. It is also an illusion that “higher quality” or “newer” plugins will make your music better. And yes, I am also speaking from experience here :grinning_face_with_smiling_eyes:

My issue with all those bundles is also that most of the time, you end up using only a fraction of it regularly.

But then this bundle is like 30 bucks, frankly it is a great deal if you end up using only one of the included products regularly… but as @uarte already wrote, there will always be another deal. No need to rush.

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All that stuff is a LOT of money. Arturia is great but is pricey. VSL will bleed your bank account dry and your wifes, if you let it . B3X is top dog but it costs 100 UK. You can get free orchestras, Hammonds and everything, but as you know there are 10,00543.73333 options for everywhere. The point is, IMO, NOT to go there.
The canny always buy at Black Friday and other deal times, but every product has it’s learning curve and if you can’t do cubase basics, then your in the wrong place even if it is a top flight thing

All IMO
Z

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The Miroslav libraries are quite nice but again, they go out of range so I may go back to them once I have determined more of what the notation should be in relation to orchestral accompaniment.

To me, no matter how good a sound is, if it goes beyond a realistic instrument range, then that is unhelpful, as you may actually be using an incorrect instrument to reproduce a timbre that may sound good at the time but is not appropriate for a given section or piece of music and from my experience, this becomes evident at a later stage, which is what caused me to change libraries in the first place, even if what I started with is objectively more nuanced.

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For me, Humble Bundle is sometimes like a year long Black Friday depending what’s on offer… it also helps charities which is never a bad thing.

Thank you all for the excellent replies and advice. I’ll just get the Vegas 22 bundle for now as both that and Cubase are worthwhile purchases for my teenage daughter and her media studies at the end of the day… I’m just an old fogey along for the ride and a lot of fun :grinning_face:

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I see this topic is already marked as solved, but a few other thoughts for anyone (including the OP) who might be interested in yet another perspective:

I had a look at the bundle in question, and, while it is indeed currently supported products, it is really a pretty random grab-bag of products. If you wanted to get a whole bunch of IK products (my thoughts on those below), you’d be much better off going for their TotalStudio MAX, which includes most of their current software products and is currently on sale for $99:

My general take on IK stuff for my uses:

  • PianoVerse Max has become my go-to set of pianos (piano is my main instrument, so I’ve got a lot of piano options, most recently having mostly used various Kontakt-based pianos or Arturia Piano V3 for acoustic pianos prior to mostly switching to PianoVerse). The two pianos in the humble bundle package have one based on a Yamaha Grand, and the other based on a really old upright piano where they’ve both sampled the original piano (in very bad condition – call it a “character piano” as it’s not worth using for anything else) and the same piano after some refurbishing (including tuning it). The MAX version of PianoVerse includes quite a few others, based on well-known big names (including two more from Yamaha, but my favorite is one of those based on a Steinway, even if I’ve used others in different contexts).
  • MODO BASS 2 is my go-to bass guitar these days (formerly it was Spectrasonics Trilian), but this bundle only includes two basses from that package, and not ones I’d be very likely to use in my music (pop-rock, country rock, soft rock mostly).
  • SampleTank might be useful, but there are lots of add-ons for it in the Max package that aren’t here. I don’t use it all that much, but it has a pretty huge rang in the max package, so if I need something I’m not finding in my other options, I’ll see if they have something that might match what I’m looking for)
  • AmpliTube is another case where they are only providing some small subsets here. If those match your genre, then they may be worthwhile if you don’t have other guitar-oriented packages you prefer. I haven’t used AmpliTube much in recent years, having used NI Guitar Rig Pro, Overloud TH3, and some Waves possibilities more, but my current (and very new) favorite is UAD’s Paradise Guitar Studio. I haven’t used IK’s TONEX myself, though I have some cut-down version of it.
  • I don’t use T-RackS plugins all that much these days as I have many options I tend to prefer. But I do sometimes use their tape simulations and studio simulation type reverbs (especially the FAME Studio Reverb).
  • The other key instrument I use from IK is their B3X. It is excellent, and I probably use it more than Arturia’s equivalent and the UAD option.
  • While I don’t use their Lurssen Mastering Console (not in this bundle, but in MAX) much in final projects, I have used it quite a bit for really quick mastering on mixes-in-progress. In fact, it is my go-to for that for “instant gratification factor”.

IK is one of the worst offenders in terms of email overload once you’re on their list. While I want to be on their list to keep abreast of new developments, I really dislike getting the same ads over and over, sometimes multiple times per day.

Their plugins can tend to be more resource heavy than equivalents from some others. the B3 is a good example, where pretty much every competitor I’ve used (NI, Arturia, UAD being the main ones) is way less taxing (not a big issue on my current system, but it was a huge one on my previous system).

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