Live recording (velocity, rubato)

Hallo,
for me, mostly the live recording (piano) is the basis of a composition.
And to get everything subtle, I need the original event positions and velocity.
After that, working with the dynamic symbols in the musical text (dynamics lane) is practical,
is unfortunately only taken into account during playback where no velocity data has been overwritten.
A reset of the playback deviations currently deletes unfortunately also the position deviations.

  1. So why are the velocity deviations not treated as OFFSET according to the position deviations?
    (saved, (de) activatable and work in addition with the dorico-dynamic-velocity)

  2. A recording without a metronome (including retrospective recording) should be used for a free rubato
    to be possible. For this, the bar lines should be easy to move on the timeline. (Cubase Time Warp)

Gruß
Bertram
(sorry my English)


Live-Einspielung (Anschlagsstärke, Rubato)

Für mich ist meistens die Live-Einspielung (Piano) die Basis einer Komposition.
Und um alles subtil zu erhalten brauche ich die origial Event-Positionen und Velocity.
Danach ist die Arbeit mit den Dynamic-Symbolen im Notentext (dynamics lane) praktisch,
wird aber leider bei der Wiedergabe nur berücksichtig, wo keine Velocitydaten überschrieben wurden.
Ein Reset der Wiedergabeabweichungen löscht z.Z. leider auch noch die Positionsabweichungen.

  1. Warum also werden die Anschlagsabweichungen nicht entsprechend der Positionsabweichungen als OFFSET behandelt?
    (gesichert, (de)aktivierbar und in Addition mit der Dynamic-Velocity wiedergeben)

  2. Ein Einspielen ohne Metronom (auch rückwirkende Aufnahme) sollte für ein freies rubato
    möglich sein. Dazu sollten die Taktstriche einfach auf der Zeitleiste verschiebar sein. (Cubase Time Warp)

Gruß
Bertram

Thanks for your feedback, Bertram. You can of course record with no barlines if you make sure there is enough musical space in the flow before you start recording (Dorico won’t add extra space as you record), then provided you play at a consistent pulse you can add barlines afterwards, but you can’t record freely with no click in any practical way in Dorico at the moment.

You make a good point about being able to reset the velocity, onset and offset of notes independently. I’ll have a think about how best to achieve this in future.

I’ve been thinking about “free recording” a lot. I can’t imagine how much programming it would take, or how much computing power. But the ability to transfer “free playing” to score would be absolutely game-changing. I’m sure the Dorico team has thought about it a lot as well.

I wonder about playing it in freely, with no metronome… then playing back in a “secondary mode” and tap the spacebar to indicate beats… and let Dorico “quantize” the recording (or the tempo, I mean) accordingly? This seems to be related to the “tap tempo” function that’s been requested in the past, which would be such a great way to indicate natural-sounding tempo changes.

Along with this would be some ancillary settings, like “turn off overlapping notes on recording” and floating split points to intelligently parse RH and LH.

Anyways, this isn’t intended as a bump, I just get excited thinking about it, and I’d be curious if Daniel or Paul would be willing to share any hints about where the team might be going with this… :wink:

Thanks for the answer.

I am not just thinking of resetting the velocity independently, but using it in the same way as the offsets of the positions as another editable option. Dorico then adds this offset to an overall dynamic…

The bar lines (however entered) should be manually movable.


Danke für die Antwort.
Ich denke nicht nur daran, die Velocity unabhängig zurückzusetzen, sondern diese in der gleichen Weise wie die Offests der Positionen als weitere editierbare Option zu verwenden. Dorico addiert dann diesen Offset zu einer Gesamt-Dynamic.

Die (wie auch immer eingegeben) Taktstriche gehört manuell verschiebbar sein.

One last thought about the ‘Rubato’:
How about an optical metronome (I mean visual, colored light) to find again at the set speed?


Noch ein letzter Gedanke zum ‘Rubato’:
Wie wäre es mit einem optischen Metronom (Ich meine visuellem, farbigem Licht-) , um wieder zum gesetztem Tempo zu finden?

Definitely “free recording” would be a game-changing ability and will “make our life” far much easier! :slight_smile:
I hope the crew will think about to integrate it! :slight_smile:
Many things related to quantization should be ported from Cubase into Dorico. Still the quantization in Dorico is very limited and not enough advanced.
Still Dorico needs improvement of the real-time recording. The only way to get fine looking notation which doesn’t need much fixing is one to be a piano virtuoso, or precise as a robot, but most of us aren’t… The engine should be able to correctly transcribe the performance of beginner with at 4 months of experience. Cubase has very powerful quantization which helps a lot and also gives humanization control.
Would be also nice if Dorico is able to automatically create new bars during real-time recording. :slight_smile:

Best wishes to all,
Thurisaz

You can actually get pretty good results with MIDI recording, using a few tricks. https://www.scoringnotes.com/tips/real-time-midi-recording-in-dorico/

Dan hello,
Thank you very much for the link! :slight_smile: I already had played with these features, but still they don’t work enough well. In order to get better looking score you should first to specify the shortest note value etc… Most of the time the composition comes from improvisation… How am I supposed to know the durations?! That’s why the real-time recording needs improvement. :slight_smile: For example Overture 5.5 has better real-time recording recognition.
Another thing that I would like to see in the area of live-recording is proper detection of both hands, which exists in Overture and Sibelius. Very often
the right hand moves below the Split Point, or left moves above… This should be also recognized. :slight_smile:

Best wishes,
Thurisaz :slight_smile: