I have a mixed feeling on that one. Presently, the folder tracks appear in the arrange window, but NOT in the MixConsole. Secondly, the group tracks appear in the arrange window as any other tracks type, beside its specific header icon. So, rather than making folder tracks as group ones, I would actually like to see :
folder tracks in the MixConsole, even if they appear with a much less width (it would be better, actually), but with the same features as the already existing ones, especially the ability to expand/shrink the tracks content included in it.
Grouped tracks with a track header indentation in the arrange window, as the ones included in a folder, to make more clear that they are actually routed to a group track instead of the default Main Out.
I think that both these would solve most of the issues concerning the group vs folder tracks debate. YMMV, as usualā¦
One of the problems with group representation in the MixConsole isā¦ track order. The folder=group thing solves this by cunningly (like an illusionist) packing tracks (to be channels) within a folder, i.e. right next to each other. Then, itās easy in the mixer to do a slide-out of the channels included.
With regular groups, itās easy to have channels 1-4, 12, 18-20 and 32 to be sent, or output to a group. Wellā¦ how to elegantly āspillā them if theyāre so far apart in the mixconsole? Thatās the big question. Can you just re-order tracks dynamically? Surely that shouldnāt be too difficult, but then what happens with control surfaces? Right now, weāre supposed to use bursts of āShow Connected Channels/Undo Visibilityā for beautiful and quick viewing of connected channels, I wish this could be expanded to any selection of channels.
And the same for group tracks in the project. Right now I donāt find them useful in the least (in the project window). I lock them (so I donāt accidentally change levels by mis-click) and hide them. I prefer to insert plug-ins from the MixConsole instead. But if I had more features like in the link above, I would prefer them visible.
Iām not sure that an equivalent of the āShow connected channelsā would be helpful for any tracks selection. But it would sure be helpful for both group and folders.
Concerning the latters, I donāt use them much, actually. Sure, they can have an immediate use for grouping some basic commands, such as mute, solo, record, but wellā¦ I would use them more if :
they were visible in the MixConsole
there were for them commands such as āChannel visibility agents>Show/Hide channels for the selected folderā. This would be also useful for group tracks, in factā¦
The tracks list in the inspector wasnāt buggy : here, it is vertically truncated after the two or three first tracks, even if there are, in example, eight of them in the folder (I donāt know if it has been reported yetā¦).
At the end, I actually use much more group tracks than folder ones (send purposes, common volume adjusting, etc.). Iām still not at ease with Cubase VCA implementation : seems rather cryptic to me, but itās another debateā¦
Gonna say no on this. Coming from Ableton, I like that folders are simply folders. I like my group tracks in a folder as well. Also, Cubase implementation works best for visibility show/hide only groups.
Sometimes, we should all be striving to work in a similar way. Some of us write with our right hand, some of us write with our left hand, some of us write cursive, some of write blockā¦ but we all strive to write in a legible manner in an established language the other person will understand.
Having a DAW where there is a million different options, doesnāt create a universal workflow across the community.
But I do think Iām developing an idea maybe that would be better than thisā¦ In which Group Tracks have a header button that non-destructively shuffles all tracks connected to it into a folder like container based around that group track. Clicking the button off, would simply return those tracks to their previous position in the project. This is more like, āmomentarily Make Group Tracks = FolderTracksā rather than āMake Folder Tracks = Group Tracksā
Although it sounds good at first. I think itās good to be able to separate your visual organization from your actual audio routing. To compromise, maybe there could be a an optional preference where Group Tracks operate like folders, so that they can hold collapsable tracks within them, and those tracks will automatically have their primary routing set to that group trackā¦ and perhaps another optional preference for moving audio tracks to the appropriate sub-folder after being routed to the group/folder trackā¦
maybe this could all just be a separate track type calledā¦ Group/Folder Track or something like that.
but whatever happens, we should have the ability to keep them separate for those of use who are more advanced and use more advanced routing.
Take Studio One for example. You can put your tracks to a regular folder say string section. Now if you want, you can switch that folder track to a bus track and can process the strings as a group with inserts, sends and automation etc without creating an extra bus again to route them and do all of it. You can also still route any track in it to another bus if you want.
You can anytime turn it back to a regular folder track and scrap the whole thing. So it is a flexible system that do not force anything.
It is understandable that some users do not like it but it is a fact that it is also a very handy workflow for people that use it or used it in other DAWs.
As long as it is optional I do not see any harm done.
Imo, that sounds like an unnecessary confusing operational mess if multiple people are working on the same project file in a studio.
But letās hypothesize for the sake of argument, that everyone in the studio agrees to do things one way and not the other.
I still donāt really understand the purpose of this and Steinberg putting man hours into creating this.
If someone was that indecisive about their routing, Iām not sure I would have them work for me. It just seems like such a redundant pointless feature request to me. Okay, you could convert a folder into a group routing all tracks in it to itselfā¦ or you could just open the folder and select the tracks and use the key command āGroup Channel to Selected Channelsā .
At the most, if people want to be able to āGroup Channel to Channels inside folderā, thatās the most I could compromise I think.
A lot of things in Cubase are pointless or useless to me but I wouldnāt slag them or deny anyone those features because for some people they are vital. Like the chord track for instance - totally useless to me but loads of people love it and use it extensively and guess what? Steinberg has put loads of man hours into it - and I am ok with that.
I am leaning towards going back to Studio One or even Pro Tools for this reason (and a couple of other things). I like Cubase, it was my very first Daw on Atari ST back in the day (even Pro16 and Pro24 before actually) and Cubase has many cool features, however whenever I dig deeper into them I find flaws that always prevent me from using them the way I would like to. Like the Configurations that you canāt lock or the solo feature, which doesnāt work properly if you have automated mutes. That plus the missing Track folder feature just annoys me every day.
Of course every Daw has itās drawbacks and Cubase has a lot going for it but right now I feel there are more things annoying me than making me happy.
I am sure however that a lot of people are really satisfied with Cubase but I work 8-12 hours a day with it and these little things have added up for me. Having invested in Cubase and its eco-system I am really on the fence.
ā¦ then why on earth would you suggest eliminating them as a āfeature requestā? If you donāt know what they are for, then donāt use them ā simple.
To clean up/sort things/hide that dont need routing together ?!
Like a part of your project that is about pre process audio samples you want to use afterwards. But when you are finished you want to hide that section altogetherā¦
A bunch of sampler tracks you want to hide ? Could be anything.
Well I cant use folders unfortunately since they overwrite my tracks colorsā¦
I definitely would like folder tracks to have routing capabilities like in Pro Tools (there are routing folders and simple folders). I would also prefer that folder tracks show up in the mix window/mix console as grouped tracks, which you can collapse and see the tracks in the folder. This feature request is straight on point, as many other DAWs are really making good use of it. It helps with the workflow and is ergonomically very effective for navigation (each time in Cubase/Nuendo, I have to flip back and forth between mix and edit windows to know whatās in my folder tracks. Really not necessary.
I know this is a very old coment but I found it dishearteningly ageist as I caught up on this thread. Insults based on personal characteristics, whether real or implied, should not be acceptable behavior - it is prejudice. Reading this, it even feels like it WAS meant to be hurtful.
I have flagged the post and ask that either the moderators remove it or the author does.
Do I like the simplicity of having folders just to organise tracks? Yes
Would it be nice to have the option to turn a folder into a folder/group track without then having another group track cluttering up my project? Also yes.
Sometimes Iām doing sound design on a long project and I end up with masses and masses of group tracks. Put those group tracks into the folders with the sfx you say? But group automation doesnāt follow folders (which is a gigantic PITA btw!) so I have to keep the group tracks out.
The existence of a folder/group track would (presumably) solve both these problems for me, without me having to depend on visibility agents or the PLE.
I understand the reticence of those who donāt want folders to be anything other than foldersā¦but Iām still struggling to understand the problem if were to be an optional feature.
I would be in favor of this ONLY IF IT WERE AN OPTION to the way it currently is. S1 has it as an option as does Pro Tools as does Logic and Reaper.
So Iād vote for having both or leaving it like is.
No to this as well. Coming from S1 and Reaper I much prefer how it is handled in Cubase.
Way less cluttered GUI, no tiny folder buttons on each group/folder track where you can accidentally transform it into the other one. Much clearer like it is now, and especially when youāre dealing with a shitload of tracks.
I would only agree maybe, if there was a global ON/OFF setting in the preferences. But also then, Iād not want Steinbergs resources to be wasted on this feature.
Right now, weāre supposed to use bursts of āShow Connected Channels/Undo Visibilityā for beautiful and quick viewing of connected channels, I wish this could be expanded to any selection of channels.