I mean, I guess thist pre-fader/post-insert meter could be useful if you are deaf… but even then, a deaf person wouldn’t need this if they followed the above steps…
okay, but, in the instance of plugins in my example - it’s still not going to help you if plugin 4’s output is clipping plugin 5 of which you’ve reduced the output of.
I mean, what you’re talking about would be a pretty massive mistake to be doing that repeatedly to justify adding the meters signal placement you want… and I mean, why would you make your plugins that loud, and then reduce your faders that much… so much so you wouldn’t be able to tell if there are any problems.
It just sounds like sloppy workflow, it doesn’t make sense. It’s not the correct topology of audio engineering.
1.) set your faders to 0db
2.) before adding plugins, gain adjust your events to be at, around or, between -6 and -12. I recommend doing this in 6db increments or decrements as that is a perfect bit and suffers no loss of resolution.
2b.) If you really want to get fancy, use a VU plugin with real RMS ballistics emulation like Klanghelm VUMT and balance everything either with the event trims, or the input channel trim. see here - - - - > The Low End Mix Trick - TheRecordingRevolution.com - YouTube
3.) Start adding your plugins… and… gain stage them as you go along.
That simple.
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I do what you sadi ever, and here we misunderstod. With pre fader metering I can constantly tale a look to the signal flow level. So if I start from -12 for example I will see ever about-12 if gain staging is correct. That’s it. I mean this
I do what you sadi ever, and here we misunderstod. With pre fader metering I can constantly tale a look to the signal flow level. So if I start from -12 for example I will see ever about-12 if gain staging is correct. That’s it. I mean this
to do this you will need a meter after every plug-in and inside the channel strip
or you can use a meter at the output of every plug-in
and the addition of a post fader process is covered as well
if you really need a meter after the processing and before the fader, feel free to use a metering plugin
No. Proper gain staging means maintaining correct INPUT levels to dynamics plugins. Pre-fader metering would only tell you the OUTPUT level of your entire chain of inserts.
Pre-fader metering is not in any way related to plugin gain staging. Instead, pre-fader metering is used in analog mixers to ensure the analog circuitry in faders does not overload. Some DAWs offer pre-fader metering, but only because it makes people who are used to analog mixers more comfortable when switching to mixing in a DAW. But it serves no purpose in a DAW.
I do what you sadi ever, and here we misunderstod. With pre fader metering I can constantly tale a look to the signal flow level. So if I start from -12 for example I will see ever about-12 if gain staging is correct. That’s it. I mean this
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no I get it, but it’s pointless, you should be gainstaging with the plugins as you add the plugins and tweak their parameters. you don’t need meters, you need to use your ears and each plugins utilities/meters
+1
pre-fader metering is used in analog mixers to ensure the analog circuitry in faders does not overload.
really? which mixers? I’m not aware of any… they normally use input metering before the insert points
Normally, the level meters display you the signal level after the volume fader of the channel strip. This is the most reliable way to use the level meters during project mixing. However, you can also set the level meters before the channel strip volume fader, called pre-fader metering, to show you the signal level. When you want to change a signal using the controls on your audio hardware before recording, you might want to use pre-fader metering.
In Logic Pro, choose Mix > Pre-Fader Metering.
Click the Pre-Fader Metering button is displayed in the Control Bar.
Use the Toggle Pre-Fader Metering key command.
@fenders74 I totally understand where you are coming from. I know this post is a few months old but I’ve only just come across it. I have come back to Cubase after 20 years. During that time I’ve been using other DAWs like Logic, Pro Tools and Studio One, which all have the PreFader metering option. In Pro Tools, this is the default setting.
Since coming back to Cubase I’ve really been enjoying all of the features it has. It has everything and loving the new features in C11. In Supervision you have so many different types of monitoring.
That’s why I’m really surprised that it still doesn’t have something as basic as PreFader metering.
I read all of the comments and it seems that you don’t miss it if you’ve never used it in a DAW. Having PreFader metering to use for gain staging is a much easier workflow than all of the other alternatives that I’ve tried in Cubase in my opinion.
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Exactly Warren…this is the meaning …
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Not really, no. No wait, we can, but it is unclear to me what this will mean.
It’s amazing how many people will argue when someone asks for a feature that’s important but not important to them.
As if having an extra feature for someone else to use is going to make their lives worse.
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100% this. I am stunned it is not an option, considering practically everything else is such a leap ahead from PT for me. Glad I am still using both in this case, I guess. I may just have to do full mixing in PT.
I agree with theRoyal1. Is there a downside to this option being available? No. On the other hand, when fenders74 mentions with an almost aggressive tone, I quote: "I can’t believe that in 2020 we cannot have a choice to move channel mix metering in PRE fader mode !!! This function is required by users since cubase 6 !!! Is it so difficult to add !!! Steinberg c’mon, EVERY daw has this function, is fundamental to take care of signal level in every strip of channels and we can see if there are one or more signal flow that reach 0dbfs… INDIPENDENT by the fader level !! " I believe he exaggerates the importance of such an option.
I have often heard this expression: If it sounds good, then it’s good. Our ears are the absolute guides and it doesn’t matter which DAW you use. A distorted signal may or may not be desired depending on the context.
We talked a lot about Gain Staging during this post, here is a very interesting article about it: Gain Staging: What It Is and How to Do It.
Okay, I’m not against adding this option. I hope Steinberg will consider this possibility. However, I prefer to trust my ears.
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And no one is yet to explain still why this is technically or pragmatically needed, only that “Protools had this when I used it, so Cubase should have it to”
It has been a while since I’ve used a console, but I thought on a console Prefader metering had the purpose of monitoring what is being sent to the DAW/Tape machine, because faders on the console are used for balancing listening levels/production mix for everyone in the control room which isn’t being recorded.
What purpose does that have in a DAW?
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There’s more important features than this needed, way way way more important, not even in a subjective sense but in a rudimentary structure of the program sense that will server everyone better.
So in a sense, this feature taking up Steinbergs resources, instead of other features, does make our lives worse.
I don’t think it’s a bad thing for the user community to critique and dissect feature requests to help the devs sift out what we actually need and don’t.
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