Playback Templates and Percussion Kits... what am I missing?

After creating a good number of percussion kits each containing instruments dully connected to their own Percussion maps through EndPoints configurations…

It turns out that when all those EnPoints configs have been added “manually” to the Playback Template, Dorico will stop searching for the “right” endpoint as soon as it reaches an endpoint related to a Percussion Kit !!

Dorico seems to think “the user wants a percussion kit… here is one… that should do” and completely ignores the fact that the user has created a bunch of them and expects Dorico to pick according to the endpoints configurations list !!

Am I missing some important concept here ??

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You’d need to provide us with an example project and playback configuration in order for us to investigate further.

Certainly Dorico should in theory be able to find the appropriate endpoint for a percussion kit you create in your project, so if that’s not working we would want to be able to fix it, but in order to investigate we need some more data from you.

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Hi Daniel,

Thank you for your time and attention !

Just to clarify the context, we are talking about creating an empty project and adding Kits as needed.
It is understood that once a project has been populated with kits using the work around of moving the desired Kit on top of all kits in the Playback Template… the project will reopen gracefully with all kits properly populated (it does put a grin on my face… believe me !)

Here is a Project where I imported a Suspended Cymbals Kit and ended up with the VST linked to the ECMP TRAPS (CAPITOL) drum set which I had last put on top for a previous import.
End Point Problem.dorico (783.7 KB)

I can repeat this problem with 100% rate of success… the Kit that get chosen by Dorico is the first in the Playback Template list.

Here are what I believe would be the files you would need to reproduce the problem… If you need anything else, please let me know.

Kits :
KITS.zip (45.2 KB)

EndpointConfigs :
ECMP TRAPS (CAPITOL).zip (35.9 KB)
ECMP SUSPENDED CYMBALS (SD3).zip (11.4 KB)

Playback Template :
playbacktemplatespec.xml (8.3 KB)

Sorry, I had forgotten the Percussion Maps :
ECMP SUSPENDED CYMBALS.doricolib.zip (1.4 KB)
ECMP TRAPS (CAPITOL).doricolib.zip (3.0 KB)

Sorry that I’ve not had a chance to look at this yet – it’s a very busy time. I will come back to this as soon as I can.

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Hi Daniel,

I very much hope the next release will fix this issue, as I would be quite surprised if this was a user or a system issue from the 100% rate of repeatability.

I’m sorry to say that I’ve still not yet had a chance to look into this in detail. Please bear with me.

Hi Daniel,

A Happy New Year to you and the team !!!

I wish I was coming back with some good news after Christmas update (which was loaded with fantastic new features), but after doing some more testing, the situation on custom percussion Kits is still a complete mess on my side.

I have arrived to the point where I absolutely need to get this working and I would greatly appreciate some help on this issue.

A complete walk through of the process of creating a custom percussion kit in regard to endpoints would possibly be a good start, I could do some more testing following your instructions and would report back here in due manner.

EUREKA !!

I’ve finally found what was causing the problem thanks to the “Edit Endpoint Configuration” window located at the very bottom left of the “Edit Playback Template” window. It is effectively very hard to find and I was totally unaware of its existence, despite the fact that it is mentioned once at page 663 of the Dorico 5.0.0 Manual.

It doesn’t allow much in terms of Endpoint editing, you can only change the name or delete an Endpoint, but it was a great help to figure out what was wrong, thanks to the info displayed on the left side of the window.

That’s how I discovered that each of my Endpoints relative to Custom Percussion Kits displayed the following entry : “Drum Set (Single Player)”


This is why Dorico would systematically load the endpoints of the first Percussion Kit it would find in the Playback Template.

The way to avoid this is to make sure before saving your Endpoints in the Play window “VST an Midi” tab that the top “group” track highlighted bellow is not routed to anything :

Only the actual instrument tracks should be routed to each their own dedicated and properly labeled VST entry :

Which bring us to the important fact that when creating Kits (except for Drum Sets) to use with VSTs that are capable of loading multiple instruments in one instance (Superior Drummer, VSL… ) … You are still going to need to load one instance for each single instrument of your Kit, except for Drum Sets. This is due to the fact that Dorico is instrument based where each instrument requires its own Endpoint, and kits are just a group of instruments with organisational features.

But beware, it seems that the best (only ?) and most efficient way to create the necessary Endpoints is by clicking on the “Save Endpoint Configuration” located at the bottom of the VST list :

Following those Guidelines I am now able to recall my Custom Percussion Kits flawlessly… which is a most welcome change !!

Alas… it is not true for my Drum Sets, for which I could in theory apply the same principles and have a VST instance per instrument, but this would be very unpractical since I would then loose many drum set functionalities from Superior Drummer 3 that can only take place within a single instance. Export all microphones to separated audio tracks being the main loss in this case.

So until someone comes up with a solution for this I will move the desired Drum Set Endpoint up the list before loading the Playback Template. This only needs to be done once per project and it only concerns the Drum Sets… so this sounds quite manageable.

I hope this might help others on their way to make the best out of this fantastic software !!!

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