Playing Technique + Symbols + Expression Map Possible Improvements

I love Dorico and it keeps getting better every iteration. I think request #2 below would really solve a lot of issues, questions and limitations users have run into that I have read in these forums.

I gotta admit I’m really curious what you’re trying to achieve, since 1 and 2 bar tremolos are just shorthand for 8th and 16th notes.

Your second request? Already possible.

Playing techniques and Playback techniques are different things, and in this case you need to touch both, plus the expression map to make it actually do something.

yes, the tremolos in the VSL strings are unmeasured tremolos and thus only appropriate to 3 and 4. 1 and 2 are measured tremolos and simply a shorthand for quavers and semiquavers as @TylerE says and should thus not be using the tremolo patch.

since 1 and 2 bar tremolos are just shorthand for 8th and 16th notes.

Some libraries have measured tremolo patches, so I can see logic in request 1.

That may be so, but is Dorico currently configured to sent tempo information needed by the VST to realize measured tremolos, especially if the tempo of the music changes partway through the composition?

I don’t actually know because I’ve never used the measured tremolo patch. But further work would need to be done (custom play[ing|back] techniques) I’d assume. I’ll play around the next time I’m in Dorico.

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It seems Dorico does not send (continuous) tempo. It apparently sends the tempo once at start of playback as the measured tremolo patch from EW Opus 1st Violins did playback at the correct tempo but no further tempo changes were sent. I needed to lower the tremolo slash count to 1 in Playback Options and then I had to create a fake “measured tremolo” playing/playback technique to test (using combination Tremolo + Tremolo (measured) as there’s no way to attach it to the single/double slash glyph (at least not that I could find).

Logic Pro does send tempo continuously - patch is actually quite useful, shame it can’t be used in Dorico.

That’s what I thought. I look forward to when Dorico will forward tempo changes to the VSTs.

Say that I have need for those 16th notes to be played with measured tremolos articulation. It will not currently. So to trigger that expression map tremolo I have to mark them as the 3-note tremolo in Dorico which in the music it is not. Not too concerned about the tempo information be sent. For a given piece what are the chances of having measure tremolos at varied tempos?

I know the work arounds. And/or can deal with tremolos with incorrect rhythmic marking though. I am curious that Request 2 is there already. I am familiar with playing vs playback, but I was unable to override the tremolo (16th) note variation to get them to trigger the expression map.
I know that expression is mapped to playing technique(s) which are in turn mapped to playback techniques and that is what I attempted without success. I will go back try again.

BTW the tremolos is not the only limitation that my Request 2 would resolve. I could map dynamics to articulations like ff mapped to spicato ff in VSL Strings Pro when ff and note length <= very short. There is no way I can that to work either with a 16th note in the score is mark ff. And there are many other possible usages for the flexibility of mapping to playback technique that seems to be hardwire into the default notation marking available in Dorico. I would be great this is already possible but how then?

Ah so!
You can add you own stuff. But here is the limitation that Request 2 is trying to get around.

I create ff (2) as a playback technique (copy of ff) it is set as a directional dynamic.
I then added a playing technique and mapped it to the above playback technique.
Then the expression map was hooked up the the playing technique and I was able to put it in the score and it triggers. So far so good…


It fakes like it is a dynamic but it is not. It does not drive Dorico’s dynamic playback mechanism (which sends CC data if you have 1st or secondary dynamics mapped that way in the expression map) nor is in the dynamics menu nor in the dynamics popup. So then I still have to mark the “real” ff dynamic so that the dynamic information gets relayed to the VST and mark my custom ff for the playback technique to trigger. It is like a poor mans solution. I would like to reiterate these and many failed attempts in other forum posts can be solved by allow the user attach to the trigger mechanism that is hard coded for all the default symbols in Dorico. When Dorico get a “real” ff and my expression map is configured to send key switches for “real” ff then it will trigger that expression map but at the same time still send the dynamic information down the line. Same with 16th note tremolos, same with any other canned hard coded symbol currently in Dorico. All these have an applicable use for mapping to an expression map > VST articulation:

Tremolos (all rhythmic variants)
Tremolos (all multinote rhythmic variants)
(Basically everything in the Tremolo section should be able to be mapped.)
Arpeggiation section
Glissando section
(Everything in the tr menu)
Dynamics sections (all including gradual, force/intensity, combined)

Dorico already has provided this for the note marking all rhythmic values, staccato, spiccato, accent, tenudo, etc…
But those other listed above are lacking the same plugin mechanism for expression maps.

Dorico is so good and may very well make DAW usage obsolete! This is one of the many pieces to the puzzle of taking over that DAW department.