Just come across this plug-in which enables you to use one track and still use midi plug-ins inside Cubase. which is cool … but as an Ex Logic user I have to ask my self why should we need a 3rd party plug in to do this in 2024/25 ??
I’d never heard of that plugin, but just watched their video demo, and I have to say I’d have to ask the same question back to you: Why do you need this plugin to do what it is doing in Cubase? They make reference to needing to use multiple tracks in DAWs to do that, but I don’t see anything they’re doing inside Plugin Buddy that can’t be done with a single instrument track in Cubase.
Perhaps they make some things a bit easier and add functionality to some plugins that don’t have features like a velocity curve. But you can use multiple MIDI modifiers and filters on a single Cubase instrument track and also add multiple audio plugins. You could also save such a configuration as a track template if you want to have a preset.
The one thing I was expecting to see based on your question was the ability to load multiple VST3 instruments, to be able to layer those within the plugin, but the video didn’t suggest that was possible. (Waves StudioVerse Instruments can do that, and there are other third party plugins that can do similar things. The Waves plugin also lets you do all kinds of processing things within the single plugin, including some complex routing in your processing chains. While I’ve used the audio plugin version of StudioVerse a fair amount, I haven’t yet found myself wanting to use the instrument plugin side.)
The one thing I did see that might be attractive to me is the mention of a standalone version that doesn’t need a DAW. I occasionally like to practice on my studio setup. Some of the instruments I have and use for that (e.g. Arturia Piano V3, NI Kontakt, and IK PianoVerse MAX) do provide standalone versions, but others do not. While I’ve got a Cubase practice project set up for that scenario, it could be handy not to need to load Cubase for that.
I downloaded that plugin some time ago, is somewhat nice (but limited) as a standalone host, and I really don’t have the need for it in Cubase.
Not sure what you mean by “MIDI” plugins, never used Logic. Do you mean VST plugins that generate MIDI like Sequencers or Arpeggiators? That is admittedly a weak point of Cubase or mostly the VST3 spec, which was completely neglected by Steinberg regarding MIDI for a long time (and still is in a way).
I just use it to play with VSTi’s on its own so I dont have to turn everything on and fire up Cubase.
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To answer this part
“ I’d never heard of that plugin, but just watched their video demo, and I have to say I’d have to ask the same question back to you: Why do you need this plugin to do what it is doing in Cubase? They make reference to needing to use multiple tracks in DAWs to do that, but I don’t see anything they’re doing inside Plugin Buddy that can’t be done with a single instrument track in Cubase.”
I simply want to be able to insert a midi plug-in, cubase has its own midi plug-ins and I love them all , it what to be able to insert 3rd plugs . That’s all . Since coming back to c13 now c14 , i’ve really cut down on all third-party plug-ins. I wanna keep things stripped down and simple going forward
but the ability to insert a third-party midi plug-in to me seems a basic need.
Also, I found this plug-in whilst buying grumpy monkey Plug-ins and Kontakt Scripts
They are amazing. They also come with midi plug-in versions of the Kontakt scripts which are wonderful , !
The problem is that there are no “MIDI plugins” per se… VST3 was only designed to be an audio effect or instrument plugin. The Cubase internal MIDI plugins use a different, proprietary Framework, which doesn’t seem to be open to 3rd party developers. While I usually have no need for that, I agree that this is an oversight.
I think you’re wrong. I believe there is a MIDI plugin framework for 3rd party developers. It’s just that it never caught on. I don’t even think any other DAW besides Cubendo supports it.
I do remember seeing 3rd party MIDI plugins for sale years and years ago.
EDIT:
I couldn’t find any mention of a MIDI Plugin SDK on 3rd-Party Developers Support & SDKs | Steinberg
But I did find this site: https://midi-plugins.de/
I think those are the 3rd party plugins I remember from the past.
What could be cool is have 3rd party midi plugs were the new Modular’s are 
Okay, thanks. I didn’t realize the MIDI inserts were specific to Cubase MIDI plugins. Then again, I think it’s been ages since I’ve even tried any third-party MIDI plugins (and that was back when I was using SONAR).
There definitely was something called MFX in the past. I don’t know where it came from, but I do know SONAR supported it, as I reviewed a package called JMT Orchestrator for the CakewalkNet ezine (https://rickpaulmusic.com/wp-content/uploads/articles/jmt-orchestrator-review.pdf) back in 2005. I also seem to vaguely remember that those may have broken once SONAR switched to 64-bit.
Yes, there was actually an SDK, but it hasn’t been available for years (the last version from those midi-plugins is 24bit and from 2017), and as you wrote, it didn’t really catch on, because developers just used VST2 for MIDI FX processing, which worked in most DAWs instead of just Cubase (and Cakewalk). With VST3 that came to a stop for a long time, and Steinberg just doesn’t seem to care about MIDI generator/processing plugins (which is somewhat weird considering Cubase’s own legacy as a MIDI sequencer)
I don’t know exactly about AU and AAX, but it seems that both can be used in Logic/Protools as MIDI plugins.
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It’s the
a.k.a. “VST-MA” which is the framework for developing MIDI Effects.
Unfortunately this hasn’t seen any updates since 2004. That doesn’t mean it doesn’t work , just that its future would seem uncertain at this time.
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We could do with an open midi plug in format , like vst3 , then the flood gate would open I’m sure
But isn’t that exactly what Steinberg already tried with MIDI FX (se above)?
(Also, the VST3 SDK is only free to use if your product is released as open source.)
Okay, that’s interesting, I just haven’t seen any developers developing mid effects for Cubase , which seems odd seeing as how long it’s been going and popular this DAW is. I have seen Midi plugins for Logic but that’s about it
Exactly. The MIDI plugin market is weirdly stagnant. Steinberg needs to lower barriers for developers if they want innovation in MIDI effects. Potential is definitely there.
Hey all. I’m a (very) long time Cubase user, and also happen to be the co-owner and co-developer of Modalics (and Plugin Buddy).
First of all it’s important to mention that Plugin Buddy is free.
We really made it for three main things:
- The ability to chain 3rd party midi plugins into an instrument, with no routing or latency (some DAWs add latency when routing MIDI from one track to an other).
- The ability to load VST3 plugins in AAX/AU hosts.
- The ability to save/load chains between different DAWs and standalone.
For those that don’t know the rest of our product line, we make things like Beat Scholar (drum sequencer) and EON-Arp (arpeggiator) that people want to use with their own synth plugins, and the MIDI routing in most DAWs is actually our #1 support issue.
We basically made Plugin Buddy to help people do that and reduce the friction. It would be nice if Cubase would have MIDI chains of 3rd party plugins built in, but for some reason it’s not built in currently.
Logic (back to the OP) does have the concept of a 3rd party “MIDI FX”, but it’s only with a plugin that’s built with a special flag. So in Logic you can’t output MIDI out of your instrument - so we have to build two different versions of our MIDI-outputting plugins (because they also have sound) for that to work.
Hope that makes sense.
Eyal
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Hi @EyalAmir, and welcome back to the Steinberg forum!
Two questions:
- What is the specification of 3rd party MIDI plugin that can be used within Plugin Buddy?
- Can Plugin Buddy load VST 2 plugins?*
*This is important because we expect Cubase to drop VST2 soon. A wrapper VST3 plugin such as Plugin Buddy that could load VST2 plugins would be useful.
Basically any VST3 instrument that outputs MIDI would work there.
Examples are quite a lot of drum machines, arpeggiators, sequencers, etc. Some that I know of are Harmony Bloom, Scaler2, Xfer Cthulhu… etc, and of course some of the Modalics plugins like EON-Arp and Beat Scholar.
Also Plugin Buddy has some built in (also free) MIDI plugins included like a graphical multi stage Velocity Curve.
Currently no. This is not a technical issue but a legal one - we did sign the VST2 agreement back in 2017-2018, but weren’t sure of the legal situation with hosting them so decided to opt out of this for now.
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