Quicktime on Windows

I don’t want to say “I told you so”, but…

https://www.us-cert.gov/ncas/alerts/TA16-105A

DG

We have a topic started on this here.

It has been known for a very long time that Apple is on the verge of dropping Quicktime For Windows.
And it has been discussed here before too. https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=240&t=89337&p=503175&hilit=video+engine#p503175
(It has been known since 2013 that Apple would drop QT for Windows, they just didn’t under pressure of big players like BlackMagic)

Anyway, on subject.
As our friend Pål said in another thread:

You can remove the QT player only. This still leaves the QT libs there which is what Nuendo needs.

Pål

Fredo

And some of us said even half a decade ago that relying on QT/Apple wasn’t the best thing to do, since Apple drops standards and technology whenever they feel like it.

You can remove the QT player only. This still leaves the QT libs there which is what Nuendo needs.

Pål

OK

  1. How do I do that?
  2. Is it true also for my Pro Tools system?

So are you sure that the vulnerabilities are in the player only and not in the web plugin and framework?

I think that nothing is sure. You can tell by Steinberg announcement not taking responsibility or give any straight instructions.

Maybe something good will happend from this odd situation and it will force Steinberg to do something about the video limitations on the next update, Which Im sure gonna be delayed.again.

It was mentioned here not that long ago (a few months ago) that Steinberg was developing a NEW video engine because they knew Quicktime was end-of-life, deprecated.

Of all the software companies products that I have paid good money for and use daily, Steinberg is the ONLY one that has come out and publically said even before this announcement came last week and said they were actively developing a replacement for QuickTime to remove their dependance on it. Every single DAW and Video NLE relies on QuickTime right now. Every one.

Steinberg gets kicked a lot around here but on this issue they can be seen as a leader in dealing with it. They should get credit where credit is due and here they deserve it, even if many of us have been wondering for years why the software industry that uses QuickTime has waited so long to get off the Apple habit.

Just know that most businesses (and people) only deal with issues when they have to because there is so much else to attend to. And also know that all the software companies that rely on the 32 bit version of QuickTime are now very much moving towards a new solution. To paraphrase a developer for a Color Grading Application, “It’s good that we all know now that QuickTime is publically end of life so the industry will do something about it. Sometimes it takes a kick like this to get the industry moving on an issue like this.” Do you remember Y2K?

I’m not entirely sure, but as far as I know AVID / PT has solved this with the integration of the AVE from Media Composer that bypasses QuickTime.

I am sure you are correct. When posting up yesterday I neglected to think of ProTools. My thoughts were largely around the NLEs and Ableton Live which I and many rely on daily. Although PT may rely on QT libraries to handle most codecs other than DNxHD/HR.The player is the issue but many of the public will think all of QT must go.

Steinberg deserves credit when it comes to its vision and either invention or adaption of new features. It’s been way ahead of Avid in that department for a long time. Too bad it’s still catching up on the basics.

When it comes to QT though I think the issue here is that “we” warned that it was a bad idea to rely on Apple, and we did so a long time ago (I know I did it about half a decade ago). So it’s great that they started working on this before this became a public issue, but having had a looong time to think about this, not to mention from the get go, the primary issue in my opinion right now is that they’re stuck with this issue and fixing bugs and undoubtedly creating a 7.5 version to make more money. Those are three big “items” to work on. Had they dealt with this a few years back they could have sat back and gone “Hey, check us out, we figured this out years ago and don’t have to rush now to make users feel safe”. Instead users are now on the one hand worried about QT being a security risk while simultaneously wanting stuff to work properly and then on top of that knowing that SB is working on 7.5 and enhanced/new features, all three taking development time.

And I think it’s worth pointing out that the biggest risks appear (to me at least) to exist where the “basics” of the app is modified. So you have a well functioning audio- and automation-engine (meaning summing/routing) and then you do some fundamental changes to it to incorporate VCAs, and you end up with a massive problem on a very fundamental level. At one point (version 3 or 4) the video import was so broken it could cut off video randomly at the end of a file. Again, basics. So, here again we should be cautioning SB to take its time and do it right, since the video engine is fundamental to a post-DAW. I’m far more worried about suffering a problem due to a programming error rather than a security risk.

So time management is to me the big issue.

That can all be true, but when 99,99% of the world is working with .mov’s (and that inlcudes hardware manufactureres like Blackmagic and so), it is very hard to create, enforce, invent, implement a new engine that will be future proof, and also support the .mov’s the whole world was using.

Now it is clearin which direction the “new” standard is evolving, and what can and needs to be done to create a solid cross-platform video engine.

Fredo

Just for the fun of it, Microsoft dropped video playback tech much faster than Apple dropped QT.
Problem with QT is that it is so old, but the api is so wildly used.
Tech moves ahead, its just the way it is.
iOS has been on AV foundation all the time. OS X has had AV foundation for many years. More and more software moves over.
On Windows Steinberg simply have to support the native apis there. This will all improve for the better.

And once again. Remove the QT player on Windows and you are safe for now. Cubendo still working.

Pål

Exactly. When QT was introduced in Nuendo it was a way to guarantee identical and hassle-free cross platform playback of a lot of codecs. I remember the confusion about codecs and their merits in Windows that could lead to Nuendo being unable to play a video file after a CD burning app was installed. It was a complete nightmare to be quite honest.

Now Apple is dropping a bomb on the creative media industry again, dropping QT shows their lack of commitment. It annoys the hell out of me and I’m sure Steinberg and other companies in the software industry feel even worse.

I have a lot of confidence in Steinberg getting this right, but it’s a problem with a lot of different aspects, you need to make sure different hardware solutions and operating systems all work well. Avid, although a major player in the video world, got seriously burnt with the AVE in PT that works very badly with black magic cards (but well with AJA) on OS X for example.

Since Steinberg must have been working on this for a while I would be interested to know where we stand here, Apple might drop the bomb on OS X users soon as well.

Oliver

I would just like to comment that this isn’t a bomb. It has been known for years that Apple drops QT player and QT api.
On OS X a lot is dropped in QT already, and soon all is dropped.

IMO it is Adobe and Avid that is the reason why Apple haven’t dropped it 100% years ago.
PT will also have to go through the same.
Adobe are implementing it.
DaVinci Resolve implemented it apprx. a year ago. etc. etc.

This is how the industry works. Some legacy code has to be dropped sooner or later to make it possible to improve and move on.

Btw. It is because of QT that we have such dreadful output res. and hz support on Blackmagic. With native tech. it is a whole lot better.

Pål

Again, as I said before I am not an expert on the topic, but afaik the new AVE (Avid video engine) in PT can handle mxf with DnxHd natively. The transition in PT seems to be complete. Performance on Blackmagic/OS X is poor and much better on AJA devices.

I’d be interested to know where we stand in Steinberg land. While it does not seem to be a problem on OS X yet, it might soon turn into one.

Fair points. I agree.

Let it be clear! We are not talking about file formats. This has nothing todo with QT api.
So .mov files etc. etc. will of course not change.
Do not mix files with QT player with QT api.

QT api is what Steinberg and others have to drop.
QT player is what is infected.

.mov files and its likes are not hurt or will change.

Pål

Hello,

I would just like to comment that this isn’t a bomb. It has been known for years that Apple drops QT player and QT api.
On OS X a lot is dropped in QT already, and soon all is dropped.

It’s not a bomb indeed, the QT that’s being dropped from Windows is already deprecated on OSX and has been for some time. QT 7 on the Mac has not been a standard install for quite a few years although we still installed it because it had some conversion options that were useful. QT-X on the Mac is based on AV Foundation and is not “that” QT. Yes, confusing because the name is the same but nonetheless QT-X was never developed for Windows because it’s based on AV Foundation, and the “old” end-of-life QT was officially dropped from the Mac some time ago.

As previously noted this doesn’t affect .movs and better solutions exist.

Hugh

I still haven’t bothered with this, but for those that want to it might be good if those of you that have removed the QT player only but left QT libs/api in place so that Nuendo still works could explain how it’s done, step-by-step.