Score Editor: instruments randomly changing on their own

Cubase
, ,
1

Hello,

Since it became interoperable with Dorico, I have been working extensively with the Score Editor, which has become an indispensable feature in my workflow (and many thanks to Steinberg for that). However, I have a recurring issue that really bothers me on a daily basis and whose origin I cannot figure out. I have not been able to find any topic discussing it.

Regularly, instruments change on their own in the Score Editor for no reason. This does not happen once in a while but constantly, even when I am not touching the part in question.

For instance, I assign a Tuba to a part. When I open the score after a while, I notice something is wrong (incorrect clef, a bracket that has become disconnected). I open the instrument tab in the settings, and the tuba is indeed selected. But when I go into the menu, I realize that in fact a different instrument is checked, which explains the issue. I have to search for the instrument and select it again.

What is particularly frustrating is that not only do I have to reload the instruments in the settings multiple times, but I also sometimes lose the quantization and filtering settings in the process, which can cause me to lose information without realizing it, since I have to perform this operation constantly.

This problem often appears when I select multiple tracks in the Score Editor, and fixing one instrument often forces me to fix the others, which is driving me a little crazy after a while :slight_smile:

Is this a bug, or is there a setting I am unaware of that is throwing everything off each time?

Thank you very much for your help,

2

Yes, I have seen this, so I’m glad someone posted about it.
I have experienced the same thing, albeit the instruments involved are fiddle, viola, cello.

I have yet to report it since I can’t find a specific reproduction sequence to include in a bug report.

Do you use the Key Editor? I lean toward thinking it might have to do with opening the Key Editor after assigning instruments to staves. When Global Tracks are showing midi parts, I think I noticed the assigned instrument change after having selected different parts (sync editors with selection should be active (not in front of Cubase at the moment)).
At some point afterwards I observed that the clefs changed, and upon investigating in Instrument Settings these were set to “Fiddle” instead of Cello, Viola.

edit… you mentioned selections too, but in the score editor

3

Thank you Steve! I am already reassured to know I am not the only one experiencing this issue :slight_smile:

Do you use the Key Editor? I lean toward thinking it might have to do with opening the Key Editor after assigning instruments to staves.

Indeed, I didn’t mention it because I was not sure, but I do suspect a connection!

In my workflow, I often use my triple monitor setup with the Project Window on window 1, the Key Editor on window 2, and the Score Editor on window 3. When I work, I first select in the Timeline the containers I want to work on at a given moment, then I edit notes/controllers/articulations in the Key Editor while adding musical information in the Score Editor in anticipation of when I will move to Dorico. But I have the impression that it also happens even when the Key Editor is not being used simultaneously.

I have noticed that often (I cannot say whether it is systematic or not) the instrument that substitutes itself for the one I want is an instrument I have recently used or selected, but never one that has never been used in the project (nor even one that would correspond to a misinterpretation of the track name because I use French - “Cordes” is interpreted by default as a Horn by Cubase instead of Strings).

4

Interesting! I also have multiple screens – either 2 or 3 – with the Score Editor on one, Key Editor on another.

I can’t tinker with this today probably, but asap I’ll have a look at creating a repro sequence

5

Thank you so much!

By the way, I have just discovered today (and you will tell me it was about time!!!) that by default the Score Editor layout was synchronized with the Key Editor, but that you could have fixed custom layouts for the Score Editor, which I imagine should allow me to limit this issue somewhat (while also gaining the comfort of working with the full score without having all the tracks showing through in the Key Editor).

6

Do let me know if that works!

7

In fact, the problem does not disappear completely when using fixed Score Editor layouts (I have had tracks changing instruments again in the last hour) but it does limit it somewhat in practice, since given my workflow I have less need to “fiddle with” the Key Editor. Let’s just say I will still lose time, but a little less. The issue is still there, unfortunately.

8

Also seen it here - especially transposed instruments (Bb trumpet, saxes etc) changing to concert…

I have multiple screens and parts are often moved from the lower pane editor to the separate window on a secondary screen.

9

Can you please try this repro?

New empty project

  • create Five midi tracks, name them Violin, Violin 2, Viola, Cello, Bass (Note that Cubase will automaitaclly select Bass Singer, not double bass, but this is fine for our purpose.
  • create midi parts on each track (let’s say 32 bars)
  • open the Score Editor on a second Screen
  • open the Key Editor in a window on different screen
  • in the key editor activate Global Tracks to see the midi parts
  • Close the Score Editor
  • repeatedly select and deselect the parts in the global view of the Key Editor
  • now, add a note or two to each part
  • Open the Score Editor

Have any of the instruments changed?

Here, Cello got switched to Bass Singer
wrongInst
@mducharme

11

Ah ah ah, that’s funny because on my end, each violin became a Fiddle. Other parts remained intact.

12

This issue is driving me crazy! I’m doing vocal scores - Soprano, Alto, Tenor, Bass, etc and it keeps switching to random instrument types.

This also come up in this thread where I document some screenshots of what I am seeing:

13

Did you see, that paul walmsley (SB Dev), responded in that thread, kindly asking for an actual project to examine..?

"It would be more useful if you are able to reproduce the sequence of steps to reproduce the bug, along with a project that shows the problem."

I see Steve (moderator) has posted above, providing steps to repro.

But seems a project will be the kicker, to properly investigate. I mean, there’s a direct response from an actual developer involved, wanting to engage… The pictures aren’t enough/aren’t satisfactory to pindown the (cause of the) issue.

14

voila
changeinstrument bug.cpr (1019.8 KB)

15

As Steve has demonstrated, it seems easy for any developer to reproduce the bug immediately from scratch (and therefore to generate a file).

I was able to reproduce it by following the steps on a blank file, so I doubt it is related to our specific projects but I may be wrong.

NB: sorry for the duplicate with the previous topic, I had not found it when I searched.

17

I was in panic… after having printed all the parts for any instrument I’ve seen that there was the same your problem, caused by wrong instrument (with the wrong transpose).
The same for chorus, where, for example, tenor (singer) was in Bb, like a Tenor Sax.
Now I’ve corrected them all, but it’s more easier doing that, knowing that the problem is not only for me.
I have also the problem dued to the not update in real time of notes and text (Lyrics) of the score in projects previous 15.0.2x , but I hope they would correct ASAP this mistake.
In any case something in score editor has been changed in the last updates…

18

I have the same problem!
This happens all the time. Very frustrating!

The tracks have the right names (e.g. Violin 1, violin 2, trumpet 1, etc..)
And the pitches are in the normal instrument range. These 2 things are - according to AI - what make the score override your choices.
To make it worse - when I go to layout settings, general, it shows the right instrument, but when I click the instrument type, it’s all over the place.
I mean - how can a trumpet be mistaken for a violoncello or crotales for a contrabass ?
And when I have corrected some tracks I can start all over again a little later, because the corrected tracks have changed. Even without starting playback.
There are no hidden program changes in the score. The associated VST’s dont change.

And the “lock layout” button is greyed out, so I can’t lock the layout.
The problem is present in CB 14 too.

To put salt in the wound - when exporting to Dorico I get the wrong assignments :angry:
And when I correct them in Dorico they change again!

Please fix!!

19

Thanks to @steve for the repro steps and project. However, I’ve just spent a while trying to reproduce it both from the steps and the attached project, and I couldn’t get it to go wrong at all. (There is the slight quirk that violin shows as ‘fiddle’ and bass as ‘string bass’, in the instrument picker, but this is because these are aliases to the same instrument).

The way the instrument detection works is that the first time the score editor is opened, it will try to infer the instrument type from the track name and pitch ranges, and then that is set as an internal property of the track. When you open the score editor again, it will use that stored instrument type – it shouldn’t change the type.

So I suspect the problem is in the logic that tells the score editor which tracks to show in the score editor, so it’s showing those of a different instrument. I think it probably requires a specific sequence of track selection operations in the key editor, but I’ve been unable to find a sequence that triggers the bug.

20

Hi Paul,

It could be something else. It does it if I’m on the score page, and don’t select anything else than the same track.
I copied the tracks from the affected cpr to a new file and it seems to behave a little better.
The only things that change now are flute to alto flute and oboe to bariton oboe. And of course violin to fiddle.
Did you have a look at the Dorico file ( an export from Cubase) I sent you ? - it does the same thing.

Happy hunting :slight_smile:

21

Yes I did look at the Dorico project, but the Dorico project already has the wrong instrument mappings set, so the problem is in Cubase. If you can send the Cubase project with a set of steps to show the problem where trying to change the instruments doesn’t set them correctly then that would be very useful.

22

I can’t seem to reproduce the issue either given the steps from @steve

I remember I was tagged originally but then I forgot to get back to this before, sorry about that.