Sick and tired of Steinberg, here's why

Read Steve’s (website mod) comment.

Hi Kevin, that’s a huge question with tons of variables. I seriously wish there was a simple answer I could give. I’ve not had the issue you have had with any install I’ve done since CB5 and N4 including trials on test machines. I’m glad to hear your system is back up and running ok now :wink:

Like I said, steve says nothing of the sort. Maybe you didn’t intend to use quote marks :wink:

I suppose that the issue I have with this thread is the title, especially given that most users have not had issues with the demo. Having frequented this forum for many more years than I care to remember I am familiar with the issues that Kevin has had and over the years it has been a lot of problems that have caused varying amounts of difficulty. I am afraid that this suggests to me that there are other factors at work here. One of them being the system and the other being a reluctance to get to grips with the technical aspects of running a computer based studio.

Possibly I am being unfair, but I like to know what I am doing when I install a piece of software. I like to know that it goes in a folder on a drive that I specify, that the samples are on another drive again that I specify etc. etc. I like to keep my plugins, my drivers and all relevant software updated.

This was an approach that was forced on me by my terrible experiences with Cubase 6 & 6.5 where I seems to be dealing with problems all the time. I got so bad that at one point my creativity ground to a halt. When Cubase 7 came along it coincided with a new machine and the opportunity to start afresh. The decision to be a lot more organised paid off for me in a number of ways. I had less technical problems, I had a better understanding of my system and I knew where everything was - good housekeeping. Especially as when I installed a something I made it a point to find out where all the subfolders were installed.(Appdata / my docs / presets etc.) Yes there is a lot to learn, but I have found that the more you do learn the easier the basic job of recording stuff gets. Also it means that when you are being creative the technical stuff is automatic.

I have not had any really creativity stopping issues since. Well other than some of the bugs that many users have had issues with. However none of these has got in the way of the music.

Hi, my computer is bang up to date…everything, I have learned that this is necessary…I have various SSD’s installed and all my content and VST’s are well ordered. I know where everything is, but this did not stop Steinberg from giving me a trial that would obliterate my Cubase 8.5, I used to be messy but I’ve learned a lesson and peeps on this forum have helped me greatly,
I’m not a fan of computers but they are a required item for music nowadays but i don’t go out of my way to learn more, I’m to busy doing music…although you are right…if i knew more I’d be better able to deal with problems such as a Steinberg trial demolishing my installed and working 8.5, which I would deal with now no problem…
your comment that someone who knows nothing of computers should get out of music is a bit churlish …
I suppose for me it’s a principal thing, it’s my computer and if a software company wants me to try their product then they should make sure it uninstalls properly…even if it’s a trivial thing to un install and re install and re set what opens a cpr file…
surely Steinberg are better than this? or do they not care? are they busy now making sure the trial uninstalls correctly? I think not!!

I not afraid to ask a stupid question which is the reason you are aware of my problems in the past years…I again, thank the members of this forum for their excellent help :slight_smile:
if you can suggest a new title that you’d be happier with I will change it…

best to you my friend… :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

“your comment that someone who knows nothing of computers should get out of music is a bit churlish …” I am not sure where I have said that. I merely observed that anyone running a computer based studio owed it to themselves to understand as much as possible the technology they are using. The fact is that computers can often do things we do not expect and we have to learn to troubleshoot to rectify those problems.

If you are a guitarist it certainly doesn’t affect your playing if you cannot set up your instrument given that you can get someone else to do it. However, it certainly gives you options if you decide that a change of set up can help you improve some technical aspect of your playing. A tweak of the truss rod, a change of pickups, changing the preamp or power valves etc. Knowledge is power.

I have had an issue with the computer that mean’t the cpr files were not recognised and this happened when installing a new media player. Clearly not a Steinberg issue, but illustrates the point that with a computer poop happens.

I am an art teacher and one thing that characterises most of my students is that they all want to be good at art, but are not always prepared to put the work in to learning the technical and intellectual skills to make those improvements. It is not until they make that commitment that they really begin to enjoy themselves and make noticeable improvements. I would suggest that the same thing applies to those people learning how to make music.

‘If you don’t like figuring out what’s happening to your computer you are in the wrong business’ is what you said…


I apologies if I’ve interpreted it wrong but I can’t think what else it may have meant…
I am prepared to put effort into making things work, I’ve been doing this always…my computer is in fine fettle now…and there is absolutely no doubt that the C9 un installation caused the problems… for the hell of it I reinstalled C9 and un installed it again and the exact same thing happened…so there is no doubt at all my friend…
it doesn’t matter to me that other software can do the same thing, I’m only concerned with Cubase…

I love creating music but hate figuring out things on my computer that should not be happening…seems this is too much to ask…
we’re not all computer experts and all i’m asking in this thread is could Steinberg please make a trial uninstall properly…surely they are capable of such a simple thing…
I think C9 is an excellent DAW…if someone can explain to me how to stop the performance meter being at 90% on a not very big project ( and hitting red and distorting the sound) when Studio one runs it at around 30% then I would love to know why this difference? this is with the audio scheme on in C9 and the drop out scheme off in Studio one…but for this I would stay with Cubase…

best to you, Kevin

Just a question about your system. When you go into Device Setup do you have Audio Priority set for "Boost"and the Activate Steinberg Audio Power scheme box ticked? I have found this reduces the ASIO load and stops spiking.

use Studio One only. Problem solved.

Hi, my computer is set to high performance and ASIO guard is on full, never had the boost set though so I’ve just done that but it doesn’t seem to make much difference to the performance meter,
I never have more than 40 tracks in total (this includes effect tracks) yet the performance meter is at 90% and sometimes hitting the red and distorting the audio…
maybe there are some plugs that Cubase does not play nice with but Studio one seems to be quite happy with anything I use,
which is why I don’t believe it’s my system

thank you for asking…

best, Kevin

Kevin, I dnt believe you’ve mentioned the suggestions I made in two (or more?) posts, apologies if I missed your reply. Have you looked at your Cubase projects for possible restructuring along the lines I mentioned?

Just my experience, but the plugins I have that glitch with CuBase on my particular system ALSO glitch in Sibelius, Finale, Dorico, Bidule, Ableton, etc. My particular PC can’t run many of the Sonnivox (88 Piano and Orchestral) plugins well at all, as they spike ALL SIX CORES of the CPU at random times. The plugins are barely usable in everything on my system BUT Cubase, where I can at least do an instant render to get a clean take when it’s time to get some glitch-free mixdowns (doesn’t glitch with instant render, just during live playback). For stuff using the Plogue engine, I must use massive ASIO buffers up to 4meg (cpu still spikes but it recovers better), so live playing is a no-go with them since the latency is so bad at such settings.

That’s at least two different core playback engines that give me problems with the same plugins (Steinberg and Plogue…not sure what engine Ableton uses but plugins that hick up on the others on my rig do it in Ableton too). It’s most likely an issue with my hardware (or their drivers). I haven’t tried them in Studio One yet, since their free demo won’t let us load plugins…

For me, I’ve gradually learned that unless I carefully build a much more modern custom DAW PC, I’d might as well stick with HALion and ARIA (which take quite a pounding without glitching or cpu spikes). I really feel quite LUCKY that I can still use an old DDR2 motherboard with an Anceint 6 core Phenom CPU here in 2017, and a few select glitching plugins is my worst problem. I can accept a few ‘work arounds’ when I see what building a nice new DAW will cost me :slight_smile:

As for the average CPU usage, I too notice CuBase uses more than other simple tracking DAWs; however, it comes with more stuff, does a heck of a lot more, and I have far more complicated set-up that other DAWs simply CANNOT DO period (Control Room panel w/talkback, Sync with outboard gear, custom remote mapping, built in device mapping incorporating sysex, Connect remote sessions, and more). So what…CuBase uses the CPU more…it doesn’t ‘glitch’ any more or less often than the others on my system. Oh, and the scoring packages like Finale and Sibelius of course use way more CPU on average than C9P for me (makes sense really, since they’re doing a lot of complex visual math to build and scroll the score).

I do sympathize with OP’s rant. Working with C9 and H6 demos have been a bit awkward this past cycle for me as well (I went ahead and upgraded rather than try to roll back, as I predicted it would be a bit more involved to roll back this time around). I see it as a necessary evil though, because the eLicenser system is evolving a bit. I.E. A growing number of Steinberg apps and plugins can be used without the dongle, which needed new and different keys, so that may be a the reason rolling back after the Demo has been a PITA for some users. In the long run, this could be a GREAT thing for us users though. Another issue is plugin naming and identification. If they use something different, then older projects could break…when they keep it the same (but backward compatible), all your old projects just work, and it’s a smoother transition to the ‘new version’, but ‘rolling back’ to an older version can be a little bit more involved.

Mainly, I think it’s important to realize that with ANY DAW…by the time one strings it out to have all the features, plugins, bells, and whistles of CuBase Artist/Pro/Nuendo, things CAN and WILL go wrong when trying to maintain various versions of a DAW on the same system.

As someone on a beta testing team or two…I highly recommend multiple hard drives (dual boot, or simply use a swappable caddy). Keep your stable (working) music system isolated from everything else. Drives are cheap enough these days to keep a back-up, and several different base configurations for different jobs. Experiment, evaluate, and play games on a totally different system-drive :slight_smile:

If you mean the post about being tidy then yes I saw it…I already am tidy my friend…I have an SSD with all content, an SSD with all drum content, a HD with all plugin installers and peripherals, I know where the vst3’s are, all my vst2’ dll’s are in the same place, I have an SSD with all Cubase projects on it and all these are backed up on external HD’s…all drivers (and BIOS) are up to date and my graphics card is up to date and I take an image once a month…what else can I do?
and at the risk of sounding like a parrot…studio one works beautifully…not had one crash or ‘Studio one has stopped working’ in the months I’ve had it,
if they introduce a chord track Cubase is in big trouble I reckon…

best, Kevin

I would like to backtrack a bit and mention that from my experience over the years I’ve seen a lot of studio owners, engineers, producers and musicians that have computer techs to deal with issues I’m talking about platinum hits producers. I also saw ads from computer musicians producers requesting help.

Therefore it’s perfectly alright not to be an expert/geek. But like it or not computer music
makes you somewhat of a geek.

Switching platform from PC to MAC can also be challenging and sometimes you have no choice you have to become your own tech support because software companies can only do so much.

As for Cubase’s performance it could use some improvements but keep in mind the some sounds or plugins require more CPU resources. For example today I finished 2 projects / mixes both with about 75 tracks and looked at the VST Performance one was between 50-75 % the other was between 35-50% and some other projects with over 100 tracks at 75 %.

One of the lessons that learned is that my music will never be perfect or exactly how I want it in my head and that Cubase, Logic are not perfect DAWs.

The beauty and magic is in the imperfections. After you get her done despite those imperfections and technical challenges and issues.

Not sure if the ‘tidy’ thing was directed to me:

No…I’m messy…I just put in a fresh system drive before installing betas and demos. My ‘working DAW’ gets his very own system drive and it’s pretty much ‘locked down’ from any ‘automatic’ updates (I.E. from Microsoft)…if I don’t need it for music, and it’s not stable, it’s not installed there.

Just a habit I’ve picked up over the years to save me grief. Maybe it’s a bit overkill, but it works for me :slight_smile:

sorry mate…it was an answer to a post from Silhouette, I should have quoted… :unamused:

thank you for your post, I have become better with my computer (but still rubbish for sure) you have a project with a 100 tracks? what percentage of those tracks are inst tracks and effects tracks and how many plugs are you using?..i ask because it would be impossible for me to do with my Cubase…
I am definitely willing to accept that this is my fault or my computers fault but the stumbling block for me is that another DAW handles everything fine…

best, Kevin :slight_smile:

very interesting post, you make some good points…i might end up upgrading :blush: :blush: but then again :confused:

Keep in mind that we use different plugins. Off the top of my head I would say that I have a lot of midi tracks about 16-32 to Halion Sonic and up to 16 Retrologue VSTi with up to 16 FX Channels with 3-4 inserts and 3-6 group tracks some side chaining…

I don’t think I could do it using Native Instruments plugins. Steinberg plugins are way more efficient.

I noticed you’re on Win 7. Is Windows 10 more efficient?

Dunno about W10 but I don’t use any cubase plugins…all third party…thanks for the answer :slight_smile: