Some further questions about music frames and frame chains

[dankreider]

I’ve read through all the existing documentation regarding music frames, and I think I’m getting it, but I have a few questions:

1. When I draw layout music frames, they are assigned LA, LB, etc. But when I draw a second master page music frame, it starts at MJ… or sometimes MK… or MI. Why do these not consistently start at MB? What’s the reasoning behind choosing the particular suffix for these new master page frame chains?

2. Does the first music frame in a music frame chain always start at the first bar of a flow? How would I display a music frame chain that starts at, say, bar 8?

3. When I’m creating a layout music frame in a part layout, is it intended that I can only display those players that are selected to be displayed in that layout? I see that all players are listed in the checkbox; wondering if that’s intended, if they in fact cannot all be selected. When I select a player that is not supposed to be present in that flow, I get a blank frame. IMO, it would be helpful if the dropdown listed only the “possible” players - that is, players that are assigned to that layout.

4. Is there a way to reduce the size of music in a music frame only, without reducing the staff size for the entire flow? I know I can do this by manually selecting “Make into frame” and opening the properties for the signpost. Wondering if that’s the intended method here.

5. Am I correct in understanding that frame order (the second dropdown) can only be changed for frame chains on the same page?

Thanks. Just trying to make sure I understand how to most effectively use music frames.

[dankreider]

And when I’m making a master page music frame, and try to assign a player to it that is not part of the layout, and apply and close, I get a very strange screen - as if Dorico doesn’t know what to do.

[dspreadbury]

@dankreider

1. When I draw layout music frames, they are assigned LA, LB, etc. But when I draw a second master page music frame, it starts at MJ… or sometimes MK… or MI. Why do these not consistently start at MB? What’s the reasoning behind choosing the particular suffix for these new master page frame chains?

The letters are just the representation of an index: each frame of a given scope (master page vs. layout) is uniquely identified, but music frames, text frames and graphics frames within the same scope share a single set of indexes, so the default music frame happens to have index 1, but then the various text frames that are part of the master page definition have indexes 2 through 8 or 9, so the next frame you create on the master page ends up as 9 or 10, and when you convert that to a letter you end up with K or L.

@dankreider

2. Does the first music frame in a music frame chain always start at the first bar of a flow? How would I display a music frame chain that starts at, say, bar 8?

At the moment you can’t filter a frame by rhythmic position, though that’s something we plan to introduce at some point in the future as it would allow lots of useful things to be done.

@dankreider

3. When I’m creating a layout music frame in a part layout, is it intended that I can only display those players that are selected to be displayed in that layout? I see that all players are listed in the checkbox; wondering if that’s intended, if they in fact cannot all be selected. When I select a player that is not supposed to be present in that flow, I get a blank frame. IMO, it would be helpful if the dropdown listed only the “possible” players - that is, players that are assigned to that layout.

At the moment that filter menu doesn’t differentiate between what it should show in a master page frame (where all players are correctly available) and in a layout frame (where you’re right that really only those players actually in the layout should appear).

@dankreider

4. Is there a way to reduce the size of music in a music frame only, without reducing the staff size for the entire flow? I know I can do this by manually selecting “Make into frame” and opening the properties for the signpost. Wondering if that’s the intended method here.

You don’t need to use Make Into Frame: simply add a system break at the start of the first bar shown in the frame, and set the staff size on the break signpost via Properties.

@dankreider

5. Am I correct in understanding that frame order (the second dropdown) can only be changed for frame chains on the same page?

Yes, that’s right: you can change the order of the frames in a chain only with reference to the frames on that page.

[pianoleo]

@dankreider

And when I’m making a master page music frame, and try to assign a player to it that is not part of the layout, and apply and close, I get a very strange screen - as if Dorico doesn’t know what to do.

It’s probably a variation on the blue and white screen you get if you have a layout with no players or flows assigned to it. Dorico creates the “paper” but then realises it doesn’t have anything to put on it, or for that matter, any pages!

[dankreider]

@Daniel at Steinberg

@dankreider

1. When I draw layout music frames, they are assigned LA, LB, etc. But when I draw a second master page music frame, it starts at MJ… or sometimes MK… or MI. Why do these not consistently start at MB? What’s the reasoning behind choosing the particular suffix for these new master page frame chains?

The letters are just the representation of an index: each frame of a given scope (master page vs. layout) is uniquely identified, but music frames, text frames and graphics frames within the same scope share a single set of indexes, so the default music frame happens to have index 1, but then the various text frames that are part of the master page definition have indexes 2 through 8 or 9, so the next frame you create on the master page ends up as 9 or 10, and when you convert that to a letter you end up with K or L.

Ah! Ok, I suppose it works something like this (although I can’t identify the exact index of the text frames, obviously. So copying one page to the opposing side would free up the indexes of those unique frames that were there, since they’d no longer exist):

MA - master page frame chain
MB-D - first page of score, text frames, copied L-R (if they weren’t copied, I assume they’d have their own index)
ME - default score page text frame
MF-H - first page of part, text frames
MI - default part page text frame
MJ - new music frame
MK - new text frame
ML - new music frame, etc…

…which is a foreshadowing for text frame chains down the road - excellent!!

Thanks Daniel. It makes a lot more sense now.

[dankreider]

@pianoleo

@dankreider

And when I’m making a master page music frame, and try to assign a player to it that is not part of the layout, and apply and close, I get a very strange screen - as if Dorico doesn’t know what to do.

It’s probably a variation on the blue and white screen you get if you have a layout with no players or flows assigned to it. Dorico creates the “paper” but then realises it doesn’t have anything to put on it, or for that matter, any pages!

Makes sense. In fact, it’s exactly the same off-center blank corner that displays in the scenario you mentioned.