Sonarworks Reference 4 Render Bypass Notification

Cubase
1

Hi,

Was the Sonarworks Reference 4 Render Bypass Notification feature deliberately removed from Cubase 10.5 Pro?

I hope not b/c this was a very useful feature.

err_msg.JPG
err_msg.JPG901×658 77.8 KB

If you visit their site, they show support for C10, but not for C10.5:

support.JPG
support.JPG826×1043 76.6 KB

More info available here:

2

If you use Control Room and put Sonarworks on an Insert there instead of on Stereo Out (where I assume you have it now) this becomes a non-issue. Then Sonarworks will only process what you are listening to, never what you are Rendering.

3

Yes, you assumed correctly. :wink:

And thanks for your suggestion – it’s a good one and probably what I’ll be doing from now on.

My only hesitation is that my current CR configuration (which I’ve been using for years) does not allow me to see which CR plugins I have:

ControlRoomConfig.JPG
ControlRoomConfig.JPG233×1411 42.4 KB

The problem here is that I’m sure I’d forget Sonarworks Reference is a CR plugin (out-of-sight, out-of-mind), and I’d end up mixing/mastering through it at times. Yes, I realize that sounds lame, but when I’m in the zone I forget things like this. And that’s why I’d prefer Reference to tell me, “hey, idiot, turn me off before you bounce down that mix!” :laughing:

Cheers…

4

according to your screen shot, you are in Meter tab (right Zone) there no possibility to see CR inserts.
You need to switch (on the top of right zone) to CR tab, then, in new window, go to bottom and look for Inserts

5

Thanks for your reply.

However my problem is not that I don’t know where the CR inserts are located, I do, but rather that I’m not able to access the CR functionality shown in the image I posted – which reflects my preferred work-flow – while also being able to see which CR plugins I have.

It would be nice if Cubase were modular and we could customize the Right Zone with the modules that we want/need. This would solve my problem because I could keep the items I currently use in the Right Zone (including some of the CR and the big meter) while adding a view of the CR plugins.

Cheers…

6

But you would always want to have a room correction plugin enabled when you mix and master ?
The only issue I could see would be latency, when tracking using that specific output bus.

7

Well, some of the time, yes.

To ensure good mix translation across as many devices as possible (home stereos, car radios, mobile phones, etc.) I routinely test my mixes out on a really cheap ($10) pair of speakers to make sure that low-frequency components like the bass and kick drums will be audible on mobile phones. And since I don’t have room correction for these speakers, I switch Reference off. And ditto for cheap headphones that Sonarworks does not supply profiles for.

In fact, since my workflow involves constantly switching back and forth between different monitors/headphones, Reference is actually off most of the time. I only engage it toward the end to hear what my mix ‘really’ sounds like. Having done this for a while now, I’m usually very close and only have to make a few minor tweaks here and there. Constaly switching Reference on/off would slow down the process considerably.

Cheers…

8

But the Inserts in Control Room are on a speaker by speaker basis. So if you have 2 sets of lower quality speakers plus your studio monitors, if you put the room correction on the studio monitors then you will only hear it when listening to those monitors. No need to turn Sonarworks on and off unless you want to hear those monitors without it.

9

I think he needs to spend a bit of time with the manual.

Cubase Pro does everything he wants and more, but he doesn’t know it.

10

Yes, I agree and am aware of what you are describing.

However, my audio interface (RME UCX) has only four sets of stereo outputs and are assigned as follows:

1/2: the control room in my studio (front-half of my bedroom)
3/4: live room (back-half of my bedroom)
5/6: FX-sends to my external gear
7/8: headphone distribution amp

Thus, I do not have any available outputs to map to Cubase’s speaker selection ‘switches’.

But thanks for the suggestion!

11

Back to your initial problem. You are correct. You cannot check the box in 10.5. I have sent screenshots and information to their tech support. I’ll post back any solution or response.

12

Thank you!

13

Sorry but I don’t understand why that precludes you from using the Control Room. CR was created to allow multiple monitoring configs while separating the signal paths for listening and rendering.

I assume you have a pair of speakers hooked up to 1/2 and a different pair on 3/4.

If in the Audio Connections CR tab you setup
1/2 as Speaker A
3/4 as Speaker B and
7/8 as CR Headphones
and in the External FX tab create Outputs for 5/6

What problem is created for you by configuring it this way?

FYI I have separate instances of Sonarworks on my A & B Speakers each with its own correction profile. Works great.

14

Thanks for taking the time to explain everything. I just read the sections on Monitor Channels in the Cubase manual to make sure that I’m not missing something, and from what I read I don’t think that feature would help me given my monitoring setup, as described below.

RME UCX analog chs 1,2 > Mackie Big Knob Passive (see below)
RME UCX analog chs 3,4 > A pair of headphones in the ‘live room’ that a performer wears to hear the mix while singing/playing
RME UCX analog chs 5,6 > hard-wired to a dBx patchbay to facilitate patching in external gear like my RNC1773
RME UCX analog chs 7,8 > A pair of ‘control room’ headphones that I use (instead of the Genelecs) for close monitoring, or at night when my wife’s asleep

Chs 1,2 go directly to the Mackie Big Knob which is used to:

  1. provide a physical knob to control the level of whatever I’m listening to
  2. bifurcate the output to several monitoring options via a (passive!) Kramer speaker selector.

The Kramer selector, in turn, allows me to switch between two main monitoring paths: ‘pro’ and ‘consumer’.

In the pro path (enabled by pushing the “A” source select button on the Mackie Big Knob), the output from chs 1,2 is routed to the Kramer selector which allows me to listen through one of the following: 1) Genelecs 8030Cs (which I use most of the time); 2) a pair of 8" Event monitors (which have better bass response than the 8030Cs); 3a) a single Auratone MixCube (on the left channel) used to check mono compatibility (in conjunction with either the Mackie Big Knob mono button, or the one in the Cubase CR), 3b) an old Peavey bass amp (on the right channel) used to check the low, low-end; and 4) my ART headphone distribution amp which has six pairs of headphones ranging from absolute garbage to my best set.

In the consumer path (enabled by pushing the “B” source select button on the Mackie Big Knob), I have those cheap stereo spkrs I mentioned in the previous post as well as an old set of Logitech computer speakers that have the magical quality of making all my mixes sound awful until they’re mixed ‘right’.

I realize this setup sounds very complicated, but it evolved over the years, in part, because I frequently switch monitors when trying to solve problems like making an elec bass equally audible on both small and large speakers. What I like about it is that everything I described is controlled by physical buttons that I can push quickly without having to stop and constantly click buttons on the screen.

Given this setup, I don’t think the Cubase Monitor Channel feature would be useful. But maybe I’m wrong. :wink:

Cheers…

15

Update:
Still waiting on a response from Sonarworks tech support. They released 2 updates recently but they did not correct the issue in Cubase 10.5.

16

Thanks for the update.

Happy holidays…

17

Here is the answer from Sonarworks:

Thanks for reaching out! Yes, looks like this feature isn’t supported on Cubase 10.5. This feature is only supported if the DAW is able to notify plugins about rendering that is going to happen. I agree that it seems weird that the newer update doesn’t support this feature but it seems so as we haven’t changed anything on our end. I am not a Cubase user myself but I’ve heard good things about Cubase’s Control Room where you wouldn’t have to bypass the plugin at all. I’d suggest trying that out if you haven’t already and in the meantime, I will add a task for our developers to look into why Cubase 10.5 isn’t communicating with Reference plugin as the last ones did.
Kind regards,
Andrejs
Sonarworks

18

Thanks again, CWS.

This brings me back to my original post (to Steinberg): was anything changed in going from 10 to 10.5 that would prevent the Sonarworks Reference 4 Render Bypass Notification feature from working?

19

Your welcome.

20

Hi guys,
Hope all of you have survived since the last post in Dec 2019 :slight_smile:
I have just set up Sound ID Reference and in exactly the same way I just read above with 2 sets of monitors & 1 headphones, all with own profiles, so have Sound ID ref as plugin ONLY in control room inserts. Cubase 11 C.R. is great isn’t it!

However, I just ‘rendered in place’ an individual track to seal in audio warp etc. (1st time since installing Sound ID ref) and that screen notification reported that I should bypass the plug-in - even though there’s no plug-in on that track of course.
From what I understand in all your comments above (including Andrejs from Sonarworks who was mega-helpful in me setting up my system), is that I should just disable that notification as it doesn’t apply when only having inserts in control room which ofc doesn’t affect the stereo bus for export purposes.
Is that correct please or is SoundID ref somehow altering my track render?
Thanks in advance!
EDIT WTH FURTHER INFO: On rendering I selected settings ‘Dry’. Also I just bypassed the SoundIDref. plugin only on C.R. insert on monitors A and repeated the ‘render in place’ and it didn’t give me the notification, so it is definately referencing the CR insert plugin and no other (just to show I do not have it in track inserts).