Steinberg, your customer support is pushing me toward ProTools HD

When I first built the studio around Nuendo 3 or 4, instead of Pro Tools was mostly based on how bad Avid’s customer support was. I didn’t like that, like any other Apple product, they forced customers to buy new equipment continually and, at the time, they were offering ONE free customer support call and charging everytime after that.
Well, I think they’ve changed a little since then but, even if they haven’t, we’re now well over 6-figures in on this studio and I’d gladly pay just to have someone at Steinberg answer the fucking phone!
I never should’ve bought SpectraLayers Pro, for one. I should have been eligible for a cross-grade discount, because we already have Adobe Audition here at the studio, but after months of waiting for someone to respond or just send something saying my purchase was approved, I needed to see if it would solve an issue I was having with a client’s stems during a session (it did not) and couldn’t wait any longer.
Only taking U.S. calls from 9am to 1pm is completely unacceptable. We don’t even open until 1pm, unless a client specifically requests an earlier session, because our clients tend to prefer afternoon/evening sessions. I can’t recall your chat option EVER connecting me with anyone and I typically wait 20 minutes or more waiting for support.

The studio I completed my apprenticeship in ran the original version of Nuendo in the early 2000s and I have faithfully preached to every artist for nearly 20yrs that Nuendo is better than Pro-Tools HD and that Cubase (being the “light” version of Nuendo) was a better choice for their home demo studios than the hobbyists/“light” versions of Pro-Tools. I can GUARANTEE you that when I switch to Pro-Tools HD instead of adding WaveLab, as was planned, at least 3 or 4 dozen Steinberg customers I turned on to your products will follow suit. Add in all of the artists still saving up to put together the studios I recommended for them, instead, switching to PreSonus or ProTools and those that I would have turned on to your products and we’re talking quite a lot of money.
I’m sure it won’t crush you but it’s enough to cost an exec their bonus.
For what I’m paying you for software, I shouldn’t have to make posts and pray someone has the answers I’m looking for. I should be able to ask YOU and get an answer right THEN, while I’m still working on the project.
My loyalty to you is costing me money right now. Do better or I’ll do my best to make sure it costs you money too.

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Well, good luck with AVID support then :joy:

Steinberg support is by no means good, but I don’t think you will get any better support from the othervside of the fence…

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I don’t know why but just recently a headline caught my attention so I read a rant about Avid and customer support including the subscription model and Avid squeezing money out of paying customer to the last drop of blood or something to that effect. Not much development or creativity has been added to ProTools either according to the article … or was it a video? Anyway I don’t really care much about Avid nor ship jumpers, but if you really don’t think Steinberg is the way to go the last thing I’d recommend would be anything Avid.

I’m with Tumppi, good luck with Avid. :rofl:

Why punish yourself to go to Pro Tools, PS HD no longer exist, they call it Ultimate (as Ultimate rip off) having some fun here but ask yourself this question. Am I in the audio business to make money, what platform is the most efficient out of the box and offers the most tools to the user . I use both on a daily bases and if I had to ditch one. no question would be Pro Tools!

I’m with Tumppi, good luck with Avid.

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I’m aware how awful Avid is, or at least how awful they were up to the point when I swore I’d never use their Cubase-knockoff again so long as I had a choice. If I’m getting shitty customer support from Steinberg too though :man_shrugging:.
Nuendo’s tools are better and definitely my preferred software but poor customer service when I need it is unacceptable. If I have to make sacrifices to thwart down-time, even PreSonus StudioOne looks more and more attractive every time I can’t get help.

i don’t really understand it or I misunderstood . Your main complain ist that you couldn’t book a crossgrade with Audition by calling Steinberg support (?) a colleague of mine did the crossgrade just 3 days ago and there was not a problem, but that is done completely online and not by “calling support”. btw: I switched from AVID PT only 2 years ago and have never regretted it. Steinberg support is essentially there, that bugs that are reproducible for the technicians of Nuendo are fixed, and even if it usually takes a while, at Avid that is sometimes not even considered. Steinberg is not perfect, but in my opinion much better compared to Avid.

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No, my main complaint is that Steinberg customer support is terrible.
I had to pay full price for SpectraLayers Pro after waiting months for approval that never came. When you request a crossgrade discount you have to submit proof that you have the competitors product. Then it has to be approved (apparently by a human).
I never recieved a response one way or the other telling me my proof was sufficient and where to click to pay for it at the discounted rate.
I wasn’t there with your friend. Maybe he got lucky, maybe he used a different form of proof, maybe he actually applied for the crossgrade far in advance. I don’t know. All I know is how poorly they handled mine.

I got a crossgrade discount for Nuendo 9 or 10 (I forget which) when I upgraded from Nuendo 5, in which I used my Reason license for the discount, and was working with the latest version of Nuendo within 24hrs, so there seems to be a consistency issue on if and when they like to respond.

I’d like to add WaveLab so that the mastering engineer can pull up my Nuendo session to make and needed adjustments during mastering and I be able to pull up his mixes when I’m the one mastering a project. I like how they integrate… but I’m in no hurry to deal with being ignored during the crossgrade approval procedure, if its anything like I had to deal with during the SL Pro crossgrade bs.

My personal experience… for what it’s worth.

I had Nuendo 1.x.x
I was able to upgrade to version 10. Took a little bit of communication, between Yamaha, Steinberg’s parent company, and Steinberg.

Within 3 days I was happy to have been able to upgrade basically a dead DAW version. The people who helped me were very clear, helpful, and as quick as they could, considering it was last year, their 20th Anniversary, and were very very busy.

I had been a PT user since 1996. Sank well over 20K into their products. Constantly was ignored by support, UNLESS I happened to be working on a Major Label project, then they would bother answering the phone or emails and being helpful. If I was not working on a Major Label project? Like I did not exist. At trade shows? Same thing. Unless I could say I was working with the biggest pop star of that day, I would be ignored. Never forgot that shit attitude of theirs.

That has not happened here with Steinberg. Sure, they can take some time. ALL DAW companies take time in responding. Why? Because this is a Global Market now.

I am so much more happy with Steinberg. And I am willing to give them time to respond to whatever technical issues I might have. In the meantime, I try to make do. After all, the word ENGINEER literally means “to figure it out.”

In the end, go with whatever DAW gets the job done for you. Tech support takes time in any company. That is the reality.

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Be careful, with Avid, you’ll never stop paying. Either for subscription or annual support plan.

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I agree with @noeqplease.

I was a diehard Pro Tools user, spending roughly $ 18K on Avid products in the span of a decade. After forking out $ 6K to upgrade from HD to their new HDX platform in 2012, only to discover that few other than Avid themselves wanted to make plugins for the new HDX cards, I was feeling more and more disappointed. They wanted increasingly more money for a system that was actually less useful.

So I switched to Steinberg in 2015, but kept my PT license active, and kept using both for a while. And let me tell you, when I compare the development of Cubendo with the development of PT the last 6 years, the difference is astounding. PT development seems almost dead in comparison, and yet they charge four times the price of a Nuendo 10 to 11 update just to keep using their software for another year. Steinberg actually implements sought-after new features every year, still without forcing anyone to upgrade or subscribe. Avid are clinging so much to the fact that they were once the indisputable industry standard, like that is now the sole argument for the excessive pricing. Pro Tools is still great for what it does, but Avid’s business model is moving ever closer to full-on panic mode. Not a very safe place to be for long-time loyal customers, and certainly not for potential new ones.

So if you worry about support in Nuendo, I would investigate if there are any local resources, some Steinberg geek in another studio, maybe someone you could hire for technical support if you have a critical case. Even if you have to pay someone to help you for three or four hours per year, it would still probably be cheaper than a PT Ultimate subscription.

Thought I would add my .02… As a PT HDX user and Nuendo user, I use Nuendo as frequently as possible and use PT only when I have to. I realize Steinber support can be slow and frustrating sometimes, and yes I had my cross-grade ‘proof of purchase’ go into a blackhole at one time as well, but you will become more frustrated with Avid. While I do believe the new CEO is passionate about making Avid successful and they have done better with updating Pro Tools the last couple of years, just know they are trying to convert everyone into a subscription model only. Recently they ran a promotion for expired Perpetual license owner to reinstate their license for a discounted price. What they weren’t clear about was you were converting your perpetual license to subscription, so any updates you download going forward will only be retained if you pay $799/yr after the first year, otherwise you revert back to the previous Perpetual version you were on before you reinstated your Perpetual license. This has the Avid DUC fuming and Avid has since change the language on their promotional page but for many it’s too late.

Another thing that drives me crazy is Avid isn’t doing much to modernize the Pro Tools UI. If you’re running on a Mac 27" or 32" XDR Retina display, or a PC using HiDPI 4k, good luck. Pro Tools ‘officially’ supports 1920x1080. If you downscale your monitor’s resolution now you get the joy of noticing how ancient Avid’s plugins look because everything is fuzzy, pixelated, and not updated for Retina on Mac or HiDPI on Windows. Media Composer went through a UI overhaul in 2019. There’s no sign of this for Pro Tools. Avid would rather you buy an S1, S4, or S6.

There’s a time and place for Pro Tools usability and if it’s a requirement, then by all means go for it. The grass won’t be greener for support and the DUC is still your go-to place for help, with all the same negativity, ranting, and complaining that’s been going on for two decades. If you own Avid hardware then their support is more attentive. I had an issue with a MTRX and they were helpful in resolving it.

Bottom line, before you make any sort of leap, take a week or two and soak it all in, reevaluate what you are about to step into, and then make your decision. I know it sucks getting black-holed and sadly it happens everywhere. However, I think with Avid the frustrations will pile on and you’ll find yourself getting more stressed out.

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