Strange spacing for large time signatures

[tmatta]

Hi folks - might great of you all to be so patient with us Finale migrants! I sure hope I am not hijacking this thread, but I have a problem I suspect is related to the OP.

Observe my score with the unusual widths of the two measures that I’ve created time signature changes. While I have not yet entered any music, I am already concerned with this “music spacing” or “measure spacing” issue I’ve created.

Thanks in advance for any tips or tricks. I am finding the switch to Dorico a bit intimidating after 25 years on Finale.

[judddanby]

Welcome to the forum, @tmatta!

Are you able to upload a copy of the project. In such cases, seeing what’s happening directly is generally faster.

@dspreadbury

4. Post a project, not a picture
If you are having a problem with Dorico, the fastest way to get the help you need is to post the project, or a part of it, and not to post a screenshot. If you post a picture, you will almost certainly find that the first person to respond to your thread asks you to post the project. You may be concerned that the musical content of your project will be judged, or stolen. While we cannot guarantee that this will not happen, because of the supportive nature of the forum, this is vanishingly unlikely. There may be copyright or confidentiality restrictions that prevent you from posting the whole project. That’s fine! It’s always better in any case to cut the project down to a smaller size to attach it, particularly because there is a 4MB file size limit on attachments.

To cut down your project, first do File > Save As to save your project under a new name, to avoid making unwanted changes to your working project. If the project contains multiple flows, delete all flows except for the one that exhibits the problem. If the project contains multiple players, delete all players except for the one that exhibits the problem. If the problem is isolated to a particular bar or passage, then use the Shift+B popover to remove all other bars (e.g. select a note or rest in the bar after the problem passage, type Shift+B and enter a huge negative number like -9999 to delete all of the remaining bars in the flow).

Once you have cut down the project to the minimum scope that reproduces the problem, in Play mode choose Play > Playback Template and reapply the default playback template, or choose Silence. This dramatically reduces the file size of the project after you have deleted most of its musical material, because it removes the saved audio engine state.

Finally, attach the Dorico project it to your post.

If you want to add a picture as well (perhaps annotated to show where the problem exists), then by all means do so. But if your problem relates to a specific situation you’re experiencing in your project, you are guaranteed to get a more helpful answer more quickly when you include a suitable project file to reproduce the problem.

[tmatta]

Ah, yes - glad to upload my score for better help…

Tom
Groovy People.dorico (3.9 MB)

[asherber]

Hmm, I don’t see any time signature changes in the file you uploaded – looks to me like it’s all 4/4.

[Christian_R]

Hi @tmatta, in your file I see that you changed the Font Style for Time Signature to 96 !!! This is causing the abnormal spacing. Try to reset it (menu Library/Font Styles…):

and use the Engraving options, instead, to scale the time signatures:

[tmatta]

OK ----

1. I set the Font size back to normal, and
2. Tried increasing the scaling to 50 in Engraving options

And—

1. The measures (bars) in question are still wonky wide, and
2. The time signatures in those measures remain small

Did I remember to thank you all in advance for your help?

Also - I read in another discussion that a changing a view (from page to gallery, for example) and then back to original view - was akin to “updating the layout”, and the idea was this would correct music spacing issues. FWIW - this did not prove to be true in my example.

[dspreadbury]

50 is not a very useful value for the scale of time signatures (we should probably place a much lower upper value on that field, though this is the first time I can recall somebody using such a large value!).

[Christian_R]

@tmatta

• I set the Font size back to normal, and
• Tried increasing the scaling to 50 in Engraving options

@tmatta
Try to put for example 5 (or 7) as value for all three given combinations (remember that this is a Scale factor, relative to the point size settings in the Font Style) and not an absolute value, so be cautious with the values .
Also if you reset the Time Signature Font, the Staff-Relative option is the default: because it inherits the setting of its Parent font (Default Music Font) that uses Staff-Relative size):

Dorico file example:
Groovy People-CORRECTED.dorico (1.0 MB)

Result Screenshot:

[tmatta]

OK - I’m paying attention!

[tmatta]

Ok, first things first - I am looking at your CORRECTED file you were so kine to create, and that is quite the look I fancy.

Question - when you created the 2/4 bar, did it also create 2 bars of 2/4 for you, like it did me? And is this just a quirk we must deal with - that is, having to delete that extra bar?

[tmatta]

OH my groovy new friend, it worked!

I set the font back to Bravura, changed it’s size back to something normal, and chose 5 for the scaling - and now the time sigs look how I would like them, are placed correctly in the score, and the unusual bar spacing has gone away. So very thankful!

I’ve spent so much time just trying to get the score setup how I want, and I’m 99% there. I’m sure I’ll be spending lots of time here humoring you all with my remedial skills and questions!

[meixner]

@tmatta

I’m sure I’ll be spending lots of time here humoring you all with my remedial skills and questions!

No problem … we all went through the initial confusion period at some time, so we can relate. And you seem to be a friendly forum member, so: welcome! and don’t be shy to ask more questions!

[Janus]

@tmatta

when you created the 2/4 bar, did it also create 2 bars of 2/4 for you, like it did me? And is this just a quirk we must deal with - that is, having to delete that extra bar?

It is not a quirk. It is fundamental to how Dorico works. Dorico is non-destructive of musical time.

If you had a single bar of 4/4 time and you create a 2/4 time signature, Dorico will just redistribute the original 4 beats across 2 2/4 bars.

You should experiment with this to understand how it works (preferably with bars full of notes).