VST 3 plugin folder structure

Be careful what you wish for … Otherwise … “Your wish is my command. Now there’s a single method.” And VST2’s method of organisation has been changed to match VST3’s. :laughing:

:astonished: The horror…the horror.

Where’s our Mod man Christian when we need him? :slight_smile:

well, I am actually not pushing for a change in that particular post, Im merely asking for the reason why not giving us this feature so many users are asking been asking for so many years…

since Chris says in that other topic, steinberg are more involved in the forums these days, so I would think that this also means more involved in the discussions ? becuase I would really really like to know the reason behind making the decision to not allow users to make a folder structure that makes sense to the users.

also when Im on the subject of letting users know things, what was the reason to abandon “VSTi” and replacing it with “Synth” in the structure ? I was so happy with VSTi, as all of my VSTis could go in there, synths, drums, samplers, you name it. and if there was one I would like to see elsewhere, all I had to do was make another folder. sooo easy.
now it cant be done, not even GA One is in the Synth category, as ofc it is not a synth, its a drum machine/sampleplayer.

so pretty please, I really want to know why steinberg decided that we cant make our own ways of sorting VST plugins ?

LOL DUDE!! what? All you had to do was - go to preference and under VST-plug-ins, set the plug-ins menu by vendor - done :sunglasses: So your BW EQ would be in its own folder… All steinberg plugs aswell.

Can’t believe we are on C6 and people missed this…

That was mentioned earlier in this thread. But the issue is that VST3’s are locked somewhere in the code, and you can’t move them, no matter what. (I know because I looked in detail through about 30 XML files trying to find how those VST3 plugins were routed through the program. No luck).

I love how you can do anything you want with the VST2.x versions, put them in their own folders and have the preferences categorize them in the same way. It’s too bad really. I have a couple hours of time organizing the other plugins, but with the VST3’s the way they are, they still look a real mess.

Ok - didn’t know that option existed. Still it would be nice to be able to sort VST3 plugins in the way you like.

+1

A plugin manager would mean more code, bugs and learning curve. OTOH we all know how to create and name folders. And Mediabay is indeed a monster; it adds friction and is a waste of time for those of us who are using more than a single music software or are not relying on prerecorded loops. Meta file systems like this are popular amongst developers, but it’s a trend which will eventually fade.

also: why separate VST2 and VST3. I don’t really care about the underlying technology and VST3 are marked with a logo anyway.

+1. Should really have been part of C6 from the start.

get a vst3 plugin name as it shows up in the Cubase plugin list eg " sonicstart EQ" and write it down.

Open the .vst3 file of the plugin with a browser such as WinHex.

Steinberg has decreed in the vst3 protocol that the Vendor has complete control over what list and how the plugin shows up now, taking the control away from us :frowning: which leaves a total dogs breakfast. Renaming the .vst3 filename does nothing (this was the first thing i tried). So this information is in the .vst3 file. Do a search for the name from the cubase list that is embedded in the file. Type a new name over the top of the one that has been forced upon you. :slight_smile:

Save. Exit. Load Cubase. Voila…the vst3 plugin is named your own new custom name in the list.

Now…

all someone needs to do is write a 3rd party app to do this for us…“VST3 renamer”. And we could all have our vst3 plugins listed as we want in the list. This should not be too hard, we have some clever programmers here that make all kinds of little apps to get around Cubase’s flaws (VST Bridge, 3rd party drag and drop app etc) so lets have one guys!!! You could sell it and everything@!

Cheers,
Blackout

thanks for the tip, seems like a really good way to deal with the problematics of sorting VST3 plugins.
I will try this one out with GA One to start with. will post here after I try it.

but… I just cant help to ponder for a second here…
why didnt the programmers at steinberg think this one up ?
I mean, I would think its their job to come up with clever things like this for us :wink:

and then again…
why should we have to look for third party plugins to solve problems within the main application in the first place ?
this should already be built into the core of cubase and nuendo. same as the vst bridge, in fact it should work perfect by now, as its been around for a long time.

to be honest…
we should not have to get jbridge for the old plugins to work properly. the VST standard its a steinberg invention, so they should have it up and running miles around jbridge.
we should not have to get any third party plugins to handle problems within cubase and nuendo.
unless… they are just making it easy for themselves, letting someone else handle the vst bridge problems… “aaw well, there is a third party plug for that now so lets not waste any time on it, those users who feel the vst bridge is a problem, they can just buy the third party plugin…”

I cant help to think that this mentality actually exists in some corners of the steinberg HQ.
and I dont want to have to think that way about steinberg, I want them to make me think “feck yeah, they solve the issues and problems users have asap”.

I would really like to see a post from steinberg people about the VST3 plugin handling, as I believe this also involves consistency about the company itself…

and so the question still remains:
is there any good viable reason for not letting us sort the VST3 plugins into folders, the same way we can with VST2 ?

Interesting with all the SB activity around here still no official line on this subject :confused:

On this occasion I would suggest that ‘No News is Bad News’

second thought about the hex editor thing…
I wanted to change the GA One plug, as its listed as a Drum plugin be default.

I tried to find the “Groove Agent ONE” in a hex editor, no problems there.
when I try to find “Drum - Groove Agent ONE” there is no result.

I dont want to change the actual name of this plugin, I want to remove the "Drum - " part of that plugin.
or is that the same thing ? does the name itself also hold the description with the sorting of the plugin inside cubase ?

haha, just wait until they lock this thread. or even worse, delete it completely. :wink:

but on a more serious note.
yes, its very odd that there is so little SB interaction on this particular subject. perhaps they feel its over and done with, old stale discussion going into the void of ignorance ?
or… perhaps its true, they are just waiting for a third party plugin to emerge, so they dont have to put time and effort into this ?
if there is no explanation about the sorting of VST3 plugins by next week, we will surely know that this is the case.
and I do mean explanation, as in a good solid post letting us know why there is no real viable VST3 sorting. not just a poor post saying “ooh, but there is sorting, there is a optional vendor sorting” or something similar. I mean a real discussion about this, as we are so many user that really like to see this sorting happen.

small update about using the hex editor trick to change sorting of VST3 plugins.

I did make some changes to GA One, and its no longer in the “Drum” list of my plugins, its where it should be, in “VSTi”.
as you see, Im still using the “old” folder standard set by steinberg, namely VSTi.
so in my VST2 folder I have renamed “Synth” into VSTi. I dont use the other synths that come with cubase at all, I ticked them all out in the plugins information in cubase, so I only see VSTi as a menu when I make new instrument tracks or use the vst instruments window (F11).

I tried to make similar changes to loopmash using the same way in a hexeditor, but it didnt work.
Im guessing that its due to the numbers of letters, its 4 in both Drum and VSTi, whereas its 5 in Synth.
it could also be that there is more than one location in the file where the word “Synth” is used, and I dont know which one to change in order to make the names change properly in cubase.
(yes, Im total noob when it comes to hex editors, this is my very first time using one).

Im using a windows 7 64bit, and only have cubase6 64bit installed. I dont have the 32bit version installed, as this time I will try to keep my machine as much 64bit native as possible.
also I dont take any responsability what so ever if your system or cubase 6 fecks up after trying this :wink:

! IMPORTANT !
first out, make a copy of the original file, just in case things do feck up on your machine.
located here: C: \ Program Files \ Steinberg \ Cubase 6 \ VST3 \ Groove Agent ONE.vst3
I choose to drag and copy the file into a folder called “original” located on my desktop. then I dragged the file from the VST3 folder onto the desktop and used this as a test file. its just the way I do things, you will probably do it in another way :slight_smile:

ok, so you want to change the “Drum” part into “VSTi” for the GA One ?
here is how I did it using HEXEdit (www.mitec.cz)

please read the lines above about making a backup copy of the file before you do anyting else !
open HEXEdit and then open the file “Groove Agent ONE.vst3”
in the Edit Menu, select “Replace”
in the search field, type “Drum” (be sure to use capital on the D)
in the replacement field, type “VSTi” (again, be sure to use Capitals where its needed)
there is 2 buttons here to click, one is “Replace” and the other is “Replace All”.
as there is only one word that matches “Drum”, I went with the button “Replace”.
in the File menu, select “Save”.
open cubase, and the GA One should now be found in the folder “VSTi”.
as I stated above, this also implies that you are using a folder named VSTi instead of Synth. otherwise you are left with just another folder…

I really dont understand why steinberg chose to replace the VSTi folder with a folder named Synth, but I guess its due to the facts of the VST3 standard not using VSTi as a broad name for all kinds of instruments, and wants to sort the instruments into Drums, Synth and whatever the rest may be…
Im happy just using one folder for all the VST instruments I use, but I can see the want/need to use other categories, as in Sampler, Drum, Virtual Analog Synth etc etc…
again, this is all about the big picture of allowing us users to sort VST3 plugins as we want…

+1

L

I had a quick look through before posting my original comment, but clearly didn’t do a good job of looking through the .vst3 file.

Has anyone done this and changed the length of the titles in there (i.e. made them longer), thereby changing the size of the VST3 file?

lets just be happy that steinberg didnt go for the Waves option in the sorting, “all in one” ?
I still lol when I see this at my friends studio, that is something you could call PITA :smiley:

I wonder how long it will actually take until someone picks up the idea from one of the posters in this thread, and makes a VST3 plugin manager. if someone did make one, I think they should be greatly rewarded from us users, and ofc from steinberg.

bumping for a reply…

steinberg, is there any good viable reason for not letting us sort the VST3 plugins into folders, the same way we can with VST2 ?

another day, another bump…

steinberg, is there any good viable reason for not letting us sort the VST3 plugins into folders, the same way we can with VST2 ?