VST Plugin Path / VST Plugin Manager

Hello guys! :slight_smile: I would like to ask, is there in Dorico, a way to add custom VST Paths, like in Cubase? I don’t own Dorico, but this information is important for me.
Thank you in advance! :slight_smile:

I don’t think Dorico has a Plugin manager of its own. It is primarily set up for VST3’s which have single location on your OS (on windows it’s C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST3).

VST2s save for pre-whitelisted ones like Kontakt need to be added to the whitelist and their DLL needs to be copied here: C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST2\ (I think it will also find any plugin DLLs in C:\Program Files\Steinberg and its sub folders…)

I believe if you have Cubase, Dorico will also pick up other paths that Cubase has.

Ulf has created an XML file to enhance the path search in this thread: https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=246&t=117228

More on whitelisting here: https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-us/articles/206899770-How-to-use-VST2-plug-ins-in-Dorico

No, that will not do. Dorico, resp. the audio engine has its “own” search paths, completely independent from Cubase.

Ulf has created an XML file to enhance the path search in this thread: > https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=246&t=117228

That’s right. As stated in the other thread, Dorico does not have a user interface, yet, for setting additional VST2 paths.
There exists though an XML file from where it reads in the search paths.
This XML file is human readable and editable. If you would not be able to get it to work, I happily help out.

Thanks Ulf. I’ll update my notes. :slight_smile:

I must have misunderstood Daniel’s post here about Cubase paths: https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=246&t=103692#p571804
(I think I got confused by precise meaning of “Standard Locations” since for VST2 vendors have not observed such a convention. I tend to push all my VST2 DLLs into “C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST2” after vendor installs just to keep myself mildly sane with VST-32 vs VST-64 issues and so forth.)

As stated in the other thread, with VST3 we were much stricter, so VST3 plugs are specified to be looked for at a certain location.
So Dorico and Cubase (and any other VST3 compatible host) will look at that same location.

With VST2 the spec was too loose. Though there is a recommended location, vendors can choose any install location they want.
That’s why you have to set up the search paths for VST2 plugs in the non-standard locations.
And as said before, you can set up completely different search paths for Dorico and Cubase.

I will update my notes.

Ulf , do you have plans to integrate normal VST Plugin Manager, like in any other DAW and Notation program? Yes we are using DAWs to compose and arrange music, but we don’t have to become programmers to edit xml files just to add a path to plugin. Also we don’t have to ask you for help every time.
You are doing tons of work to make workflow faster and easier for the users. So please implement VST Manager! It’s essential part of every DAW.
Guys, you were the dev team behind Sibelius, and there is Plugin Manager…
Greetings! :slight_smile:

Sure it will come, just can not say when. The list of things we still want to implement is veeeeery long…

Hi Ulf,

I managed to activate Kontakt 5 Player in Dorico by following the procedure explained on this page https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-us/articles/206899770, which means I’ve placed a copy of the file Kontakt 5.dll (which is located in the map C:\Program Files\Native Instruments\VSTPlugins 64 bit) in the map C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST2, then created a whitelist and so on.

But if I understand correctly, it’s also possible to alter the file Vst2xPlugin SearchPaths VSTAudioEngine.xml directly in order to make Dorico search for the file Kontakt 5.dll in the map C:\Program Files\Native Instruments\VSTPlugins 64 bit. The xml-file you’ve uploaded in the thread https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=246&t=117228 contains the following lines:

My question is how the ID-number ID=“146116144” is determined? (in the xml-file on my pc, all ID-numbers start with 32490)

I will understand if you say it’s better to follow the procedure with the whitelist and not to mess with the xml-file, but being able to alter the xml-file would mean I don’t have to create a copy of a dll-file whenever I want to add a VST-library. I would prefer to simply add the original location of the library in the xml-file.

Thanks in advance for your reply!

Regards,

Stefaan

Ulf, hello! :slight_smile: Yes, I’m sure that the list for the implementations is long, but this Plugin Manager had to be there since the first release, by default… Not to be something that would be added in unknown future. Think more about the most essential things, and this is one of them! :wink:
You are coders there and it’s not problem for you edit xml code, but as I said above - we are not programmers, we are composers and arrangers.
Dorico is the most expensive notation program on the marked + missing many essential features…
Please, don’t drive your costumers to waste their time to search solution how to add paths on internet, and after that to create whitelist.txt and to edit xml code.
Think about that! :slight_smile: It would so kind if you implement Plugin Manager as soon as possible, and not to leave it for the unknown future, like the real-time recording and CC Data editing /things that also had to be there since the first release/.
What’s the idea behind Dorico? To be another score writer? Or to be hybrid daw Score Writer + implemented Cubase-like midi editing tools /Something like Overture 5.5 by Sonic Scores/?
Personally I would like to have, for example, hybrid between Cubase and Sibelius, which is more intuitive and easier to use than both and I really hope Dorico is going in that direction.
Greetings! :slight_smile:

Fine, but actually, “Kontakt 5 16out” is already whitelisted by default. Why do you need the single player whitelisted?

My question is how the ID-number ID=“146116144” is determined? (in the xml-file on my pc, all ID-numbers start with 32490)

The ID doesn’t matter, just copy one over from the existing ones, that will do.
You will notice that after each program run the numbers will get changed anyway.

I will understand if you say it’s better to follow the procedure with the whitelist and not to mess with the xml-file, but being able to alter the xml-file would mean I don’t have to create a copy of a dll-file whenever I want to add a VST-library. I would prefer to simply add the original location of the library in the xml-file.

Whitelist and search-path-xml-file are two pair of shoes.
In the whitelist you only tell the name of the plug-in that you want to appear in Dorico, but it does not tell where to find it.

So either you copy that specific plug-in to a path that Dorico already searches for (namely as stated in the search-path-xml-file)
or you add the path to the search-path-xml. From Dorico’s point of view, there is no one way better than the other.
One the other hand, maybe the second one is better, because if there comes an update for your plug-in, you don’t need to remember to copy over the updated one.

I fully understand your point, but please also understand, that there is a limited number of coders here, and it’s the product planners and marketing guys who tell what is important and to be coded next…

Ulf, I can understand your point too, but after all VST Plugin Manager is something that has to be implemented by default… I don’t understand how it’s possible this feature to depend on what planners and marketing guys think is important.
The Plugin Manager is part of every DAW, except Pro Tools, are the marketing people, behind the other products, more smarter than yours? :laughing:
Come on, Cubase and Nuendo have it, what’s the point to not being implemented in Dorico?!
Greetings :slight_smile:

Surely no one is suggesting that Ulf steal time from his assigned tasks to freelance on some user’s pet project. Ulf has given a way to locate VST’s that are saved outside the default folder.

A big thank to Ulf who also right now took the time to help me to find the right spelling in the xml for my specific vst path :slight_smile:
In the same time he helped others and he also took time to explain the marketing thing!
Puh! A lot of work!
:smiley:

Yes, I can see here that Ulf helps a lot to the people, which is very kind. Respect for that! :slight_smile: But again, if there were Plugin Manager he wouldn’t spend so much time to help others for something simple…
It’s pointless to waste the costumer’s and developer’s time, when feature which has to be there by default, would be added as soon as possible…
and the price of this very incomplete software is the highest on the market, more expensive than Sibelius and Finale… but still far behind them.
We all know that Dorico needs time to become more complete and advanced… The team doing great job to improve it… :slight_smile:
So, for the moment with the price in mind it would be fair towards the costumers to provide free updates and upgrades until Dorico is on the level of Sibelius and Finale for scoring, and close to Cubase for midi recording and editing…
I’m still not a Dorico user, and I’ll wait until it becomes more complete and useful… I hope it would happen in the near future. :slight_smile:
Greetings and success! :slight_smile:

For the time until a UI comes to choose the vst paths from within Dorico I would like to give some hints that I got from Ulf for anyone who may have difficulties to point Dorico to other vst than Halion.
On my side I work with all kind of music software since the early 80ties of the last century and I had difficulties to achieve this task!
Indeed the right syntax in the xml file is important.

For better understanding I sum up a few basic things that have been already said in this thread.

  1. To use vst2 instruments these instruments must be expressly named in a user file named "vstwhitelist.txt"
  2. If your VSTs are not at the usual default-places it is necessary to tell Dorico where the vst are and this is done in the file "Vst2xPlugin SearchPaths VSTAudioEngine.xml"
    For example I have a long habit to place all my vst in a folder called “VSTPlugins-teacue” and not in the usual folder. This specific path has to be specified in this file.

How to create a “whitelist.txt” is well explained on Steinberg site, there is no need to explain this again.
https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-us/articles/206899770-How-to-use-VST2-plug-ins-in-Dorico

The path for both files is the same and is to find in the explanations of Steinberg

It means that you have first to create your own whitelist.txt and place it in the right folder according to Steinberg explanations.
BTW at the end of the explanations it is written that after you created your own “whitelist.txt” you should delete three files, among them the file: “Vst2xPlugin SearchPaths VSTAudioEngine.xml”
This is OK if all your vst2 are in the usual folder that Dorico can recognize but not if your vst2 are in user specific folder.
You need to edit this file so do not delete it!

On Steinberg site there is no explanation on how to edit the xml file “Vst2xPlugin SearchPaths VSTAudioEngine.xml”
Here is how to do it:

HOW TO EDIT "Vst2xPlugin SearchPaths VSTAudioEngine.xml"

  1. Open the “Vst2xPlugin SearchPaths VSTAudioEngine.xml” in a xml editor (like PSPAd editor)

  2. You will see several text blocks with the same structure:
    for example:

  1. Just duplicate such a whole text block as it is in the xml file. One block for each vst folder you need.

  2. The important parts are
    value=“VST2” on the second line
    and
    value=“C:\Program Files\Common Files” on the third line.

For better un derstanding these values point together to the following folder:
C:\Program Files\Common Files\VST2

  1. If you want to point to a specific folder you have to change this values accordingly

Example:
My Native Instruments are all in the following folder:
C:\Program Files\VSTPlugins-teacue\ni\

In this folder I have Kontakt 4

In order to tell Dorico the path for Kontakt 4 (or any other ni instrument that may be in this folder) I must change the two values mentioned above.
Instead of “VST2” I must write “ni”
Instead of “C:\Program Files\Common Files” I must write “C:\Program Files\VSTPlugins-teacue”

The whole block looks then like this:

  1. As Ulf wrote, don’t care about the rest of the text.
    You can faithfully let it as it is this will work,

  2. Save your edited xml file.
    Done.
    The next time you open Dorico, provided you created your own whitelist.txt as mentioned above, Dorico will find your vst.

Of course for someone who never had to do with a xml file it may sound complicated.
But I would say for a composer using such a notation program like Dorico, it is not :wink:

I decided to try out the procedure of whitelisting because Kontakt 5 didn’t show up in Dorico. I assumed this had to do with the difference between the full version of Kontakt 5 (which I don’t have), and Kontakt 5 Player, the free program which I have installed to be able to use the piano samples I purchased from Native Instruments. Am I completely wrong with this assumption?

The ID doesn’t matter, just copy one over from the existing ones, that will do. You will notice that after each program run the numbers will get changed anyway.

Thanks for this explanation. I deleted the copy of the plugin and added the path to the original plugin in the xml-file. Everything works fine now!

One the other hand, maybe the second one is better, because if there comes an update for your plug-in, you don’t need to remember to copy over the updated one.

I agree. Thanks again for your time Ulf!

Regards,

Stefaan

Dear Thurisaz,

Since you are not a Dorico user, please do not use that tone, that no Dorico user ever uses, towards Dorico developers. If you owned it and use it — as most of us do on this forum — you would know how much time you save using Dorico, thanks to the very clever word the developers have achieved.
I understand that this Plug-in manager is something very important for you (and aknowledge it is not for me) as having tabs or guitar fingerings or baroque ornaments or boxes for contemporary music… are for other users, who have paid the fee. And still, they do not write requests in your tone.
Well, I am not native english speaker, so maybe I have misunderstood that tone :wink:

Dear Marc,

I’m not using the tone of anger towards the Dorico dev team. :slight_smile: As you can read in my post, I’m showing my respect to the guys and their hard work. :slight_smile:
Yes, I’m still not a Dorico user, but I’m long time Cubase user. I have plans, in the future to buy Dorico, that’s why I’m asking and commenting here. :slight_smile:
My appeal for the Plugin Manager is not only for me, but for all users, even this would save some of the Ulf’s time.
About the price… that’s the truth.
Greetings :slight_smile: