VST2 being killed off by steinberg (not)

https://www.steinberg.net/en/newsandevents/news/newsdetail/article/vst-2-coming-to-an-end-4727.html

Pathetic.

About time, goody

May the plugin guys all catch up!

For sure, and as the article says,

VST 2 compatibility with Steinberg VST hosts will remain…

I for one would be quite happy to have NI Kontakt in VST3, and supporting the advanced features, like note expression and tuning to name a couple. Tuning was also in VST2, but NI and others never supported it, maybe this will be the push they need.

+1, I think the NI plugins may be the last VST2 plugins remaining on my machine …

I guess NI will not jump on it so fast and also not Ableton. For the near future this might mean, that Steinbergs Flagship Absolute Collection 4 will not be used on all that Hosts, that do not Support VST 3. But I am curious - hope all will come good.
Nevertheless - I was always in the fraction that preferred VST3 over VST2 if possible (beside the unnessecary beeing forced to install vst3 on drive c)

I think it might been have more clever, to come out with VST4 instead. VST3 was not good enough for many vendors to jump on it.


cheers

…and lets’ not forget that the standard was invented by Steinberg, maintained by them, and provided for free to devs. https://github.com/steinbergmedia

In what way?

F.I. Native Instruments, they did not see any advantage to go to VST3. I dont know why.
But independent from this - what other reason should be there not to jump on a new, shiny product ? The only logical conclusion is: It is not worth the effort for me (the company) to invest ressources in this technology. At least two vendors did this: NI & Ableton.

This are only my thoughts.

If you don’t know the reasoning behind not coding for VST v3 then you can’t really say that “they did not see any advantage” or that “VST3 was not good enough”.

The first statement presumes you know something about NI and its reasoning,and the second is a statement about VST3 itself, technically.

Yes, but “not worth the effort” typically means “not worth the expense”. That may be true, but it doesn’t mean that they don’t see an advantage to VST3 or going for it, just that it doesn’t make more money (perhaps that’s what you meant), and it also certainly doesn’t mean VST3 isn’t good enough.

Every product, software and technology has an EOL (end of life) and so it seems it’s RIP VST2 (1999-2018) – not a bad run for any product or technology.

I was glad to see the statement say, “VST 2 compatibility with Steinberg VST hosts will remain.” So, correct me if I’m wrong, but it sounds like all the instruments/effects that are not blacklisted will continue to operate per normal in future versions of Cubase. True? Anway, “maintaining compatibility” – if I understand it – sounds like a smart idea. "Don’t take away my favorite instrument or effect just because it’s “old.” Olde is good. :slight_smile: Vintage!

Hopefully this will force some latecomers to switch over and in the process take advantage of what v3 has to offer that v2 doesn’t.

Just the easy ability to use VST3 plugins in side chain mode made it worthwhile to me. :smiley:

Matthias, please let us not split hairs.
I am no native english Speaker. It looks like you got what I wanted to say.

Some interesting other views from 3rd party devs, on the whole VST2 versus 3 topic. There’s a thread on the KVR forum pages under ‘DSP and Plugin Development’ category, with ‘VST3’ in its title. Its a thread started in 2008; I’d suggest starting reading from half-way down page 5, a post from BlueCatAudio.

(don’t think its allowable forum etiquette here, to post the link directly).

I’d paraphrase the content/essence for you here; but its always better having it for yourselves, straight from the horses mouth… :wink:

cheers,
puma

As long as there’s nothing illegal, spammy or nsfw, not a prob.

https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=7057569#p7057569

This is what BlueCat Audio had to say about VST3 in that thread (written April 18, 2018, before Steinberg’s announcement):

Regardless of implementation and design considerations, our feeling, both as a host and plug-in manufacturer, is that VST3 is still not as mature as VST2 today . Many (if not most) hosts and plug-ins (including Steinberg’s…) are still more stable and predictable in VST2 format. So we still strongly advise customers to use VST2 versions when possible. There are far less surprises and strange bugs with VST2 so far.

Also, the lack of proper MIDI support in VST3 causes many problems. For example, it looks like every developer is using the same hack to receive MIDI CC events (and we do too), but it causes thousands of extra parameters to be exposed when they have not been properly disabled for automation. And if you want to output MIDI CC messages from a plug-in, there is still no solution.

So we implemented VST3 support because customers were asking for it (mainly for Cubase side chain and because of Cubase’s window resize bug on Windows for plug-ins - and on the host side because some plug-ins only exists as VST3). But honestly, if there is no strong incentive of doing it, just skip it for now.

Wow, it seems quit damnng. Does anyone here have any thoughts, pro vs. con, about BlueCat Audio’s opinion there?

I like VST3 from the point of view of: a) It is easier on the CPU (no processing performed if no audio is being run through it), b) and ease of sidechaining.

How does Reaper do sidechaining, if it doesn’t have VST3?

Here is what one programmer wrote on Gearslutz…. (I wish I had programming skills so I could fully understand it):

“VST3 is not that bad except that is doesn’t even support the most basic MIDI spec(plugin side), so if you ever dreamed of a new MIDI plug-in, Steinberg just killed MIDI plug-ins.”

Is this true?

More on the topic of MIDI, its a concerning read from BlueCatAudio when they say:-

“Also, the lack of proper MIDI support in VST3 causes many problems. For example, it looks like every developer is using the same hack to receive MIDI CC events (and we do too), but it causes thousands of extra parameters to be exposed when they have not been properly disabled for automation. And if you want to output MIDI CC messages from a plug-in, there is still no solution.”

I read some real-world evidence, that this is appearing in the ‘Fairlight’ module of DaVinci Resolve 15 Beta; complainers (3rd party plugin Devs) through BlackMagicDesigns forum, are asking how on earth they’re supposed to cope with VST3 plugins displaying/exposing over 2000 automation parameters to the user.!

They (plugin Devs) think its a BlackMagicDesigns ‘problem’ to fix…