When comes Steinberg with a userfriendly scorecomposer?

It is a ridicilous idea that Cubase6.5 offers of Symphonic soundset, but the starting composer cannot handle the complicated score editor.
It is not possible to add easy notes like in the other software programs like Notion /Overture/ Finale/Sibilius…etc
I don’t want to use those programs , because i like to stay in Cubase 6.5

Is there ever be a chance that the present score editor can be made more userfriendly?
If not, than i suggest to develop a second dedicated score editor for classical composing to use in Cubase

I do have now the feeling that there is a classical racecar inside Cubase, but it has no wheels :smiley:

Maybe you could elaborate a little bit more than just say that “the starting composer cannot handle the complicated score editor” and that “it is not possible to add easy notes like in the other software programs”.

That does not explain what it is about them that is so easy, or rather what it is that is so difficult in Cubase. How would you suggest they make it more “user friendly”?

What is the analogy of the car with no wheels and the score editor? Wheels are not part of the user friendliness of a car, but components which without it cannot perform its task. The score editor in Cubase certainly can.

You mean “user-friendly” as in “one doesn’t have to read the manual to learn how to use it”? :laughing:
And if you’re so new how come you know so much about the (much, much more expensive) other products out there?

Cubase score takes a few weeks to properly learn. If you can’t be bothered how can you expect the programmers to rewrite the rules of music as well as the software to suit you.

There are many who can add “easy notes” to Score.
And, as I always have to point out, Score is set up from other elements of Cubase because it’s a Printing feature and not so the composer can congratulate himself by watching his clever score whiz along with the music.
As the BIG heading on the chapter in the manual says; Score layout and PRINTING. It’s so he can give his clever score to musicians to play live onstage or replace midi parts with real instruments.

Userfriendly means that i can easily build up a score with notes like in the classical scorecomposer Overture or Notion 3 to mention some score editors.
Like painting with notes without thinking this to much about this, because in Cubase it seems to be difficult to get the notes you want :slight_smile:
Without effort bring in score filled with notes, easy and quick.
Perhaps i do need more training with the score editor…could be, but i know the basiscs

Well try out Notion 3 or Overture there is it is easy to bring a random note structure like you want, with ease
All is there for classical composing in Cubase, but fo rme it is difficult to get speed in the score composing, because it is slow down by Cubase , because it follows its own score logic programming and gives different notes what i want.
Perhaps a question to give more detail to the conditions of the score editor, before you put the notes in the score editor?
The analogy with a racecar without wheels and cubase is that i can not get speed in the score editor for filling in notes there

I think that you may have to study and experiment a bit more with the score editor, since there are a few :wink: settings, a couple of “modes” and then some, that you can tweak in the there.

Half the Cubase manual is dedicated to the score editor and I would seriously consider reading that half.

The analogy with a racecar without wheels and cubase is that i can not get speed in the score editor for filling in notes there

The Score editor is not really meant for entry directly into the score, as I said it’s for PRINTING, and a lot of the setup, including note entry, is best done in the other editors or directly from the Project page where you have to set up the stave order anyway. Although they might rewrite it you will see that it’s mainly aimed at composers who play the music in and then edit after rather than composers who do it directly on the page. The first priority is the audible output rather than the musical display. In any case mostly if it sounds all right as midi it usually looks terrible in the score.
For composers who need the music to be entered directly to the stave / manuscript Cubase is not at present the best product although once you get used to it you can get things done fairly easily. And it’s the getting used to that’s the hardest part.

Aloha and +1
(while waiting for Vic France (da man) to chime in on this one).

Yes, that idea comes also in my mind after my earlier experiences with the score editor… therefore maybe Steiberg can perhaps make a score editor…focussed also on composing.
I hope that Steinberg comes with a more userfriendly composing editor in the future?
Well i have invested already some time in the score editor and have tried out different workflows, and i hope i can try to getting more used on it to get the desired notes in a reasonable time in the score editor.

With the help of the forummembers in the past i could rather easy construct this score after 2 months no score exercise practised

With the help of the forummembers in the past i could rather easy construct these score after 2 months no score exercise practised

And after about the same time this eejit (conman), after reading the manual, got rather fast at putting together score examples for others to read.
At present first-line scoring is not Cubase’s main priority. You’re better off using other packages at least in this decade.


How did you get on using all the detailed advice and recommenations in your earlier thread (eg many from SteveInChicago and vic_france)? …


Those posts did seem to have cleared up some misconceptions that you’d had about entering notes.

But, is what’s happened since then that you’ve finally concluded, after studying the manual thoroughly and learning properly how Cubase’s score editor works (because you were a novice in the earlier thread) that no amount of practice with Cubase’s current score editor will ever let you enter notes without too much difficulty?

You mention specifically that you have trouble entering the right note lengths. What happens, and what would you want instead? Are you totally against using the key editor in conjunction with the score editor, and/or playing notes on a MIDI keyboard instead of entering them with a mouse?

My understanding is that many composers who prefer to work in a score editor choose Sibelius and then either (a) export the notes to Cubase where they edit the notes, and insert controller data, or (b) start again by playing the notes into Cubase and adding controller data – with the objective, in either case, being to get something that sounds more like a real performance, compared with the somewhat “wooden” and mechanical playback that score-editing software tends to do. In other words, they use Cubase (or a similar prog) to simulate a performance, because the score-editing packages aren’t good for that. In fact, there are composers and other Sibelius users who’ve been critical of the developers’ attempts to improve the sound coming out of Sibelius, because they’d prefer Sibelius to stick to what it’s really good for - ie editing and printing scores (and parts) - and not dabble in the territory of Cubase, Logic, etc, which are more orientated towards creating what sound more like real performances.

It seems that, at present, no software is good at both working with scores and creating realistic mock-ups, though (if I’ve understood correctly) the developers of Notion 3 want that software to be more suitable for composers than Sibelius is, in terms of working towards realistic-sounding playback, more in line with what can be done in a DAW.

I’d suggest that, if you want, in the near future, score editing half as good as what Sibelius offers, then forget about Cubase. But if you don’t want to forget about Cubase, join the numerous composers who use other software for entering their scores, and reserve Cubase for the depth of control that it offers to people who want to make realistic “mock-ups” of their pieces.

But, if you’re not interested in Cubase as a tool for constructing fairly realistic-sounding mock-ups, but only want to use if for score entry and playback, well, I’m afraid you might have chosen the wrong program for your needs.

If you haven’t already done so, try listening to the demo orchestral pieces on East West’s website, together with users’ own pieces put up on the EW forum for comment. I think most of those start their life in Sibelius and end in a DAW such as Cubase. Many are meant to sound like bombastic film music, but some are more like ‘classical’ music of the 19th or ealier centuries. And some people have created fairly believable mock-ups of well-known classical pieces (again, I think most started in Sibelius and finished in a DAW). A lot can be done, but not easily all done within Cubase - and I suspect that’s the way it’ll be for some years.

While I’d love to be proved wrong by the appearance of a massively improved score editor in C7 at no extra charge than a normal update price (in spite of all the many extra man-years effort that would be required to develop a great score-entry package fully integrated with Cubase), I won’t bank on it. :mrgreen:

Thanks Chase!

I invested already some time with the score editor …and like to stay in Cubase…yes.
I am still satisfied with what i have achieved… and i must practice more
The idea to think about too much, how the notes must be entered makes me reluctant to go further, but perhaps i can handle it better after more practising.
A quick sketch of a musical idea’s and learning and practising on this way in Cubase is not intuitive.

Playing the notes with a Midi keyboard is also possible…for getting a quick idea of a melody line… i like that
Working only with a keyboard in the score editor is not possible …i think ( if that is possible i prefer that, but probably i am here wrong? )
I made this short score example in the step mode and mouse… (i use only the keyboard for noteposition in the measure)
One hand for the keyboard and one hand for the mouse.

I understand you are positive about working in the score editor in Cubase in comparison with other score editor.
Those programs are limited in the way you can chance a sound like in Cubase can.
The coming Notion 4 is a interesting score editing program.

I posted this a while back, may interest you.

(I missed your original posting… probably because I hardly ever visit the Lounge :wink: ).

That looks absolutely great! (watched the videos).
I’d love to see how well a saved Music.xml imports into Cubase :slight_smile:.

Interesting , because it is sciencetifically based.
I have looked at it for a while ago, but did nothing with it
Perhaps i get a better sight on it now

We have discussed this in the past, and I think what he’s suggesting here is the Flexi-time technology in Sibelius. Record to the metronome while Sibelius uses advanced algorithms to auto-quantize your performance into a neat score while keeping the human dimensions offered from the recording.

Yes, who knows it will be improved in the future versions of Cubase ?
The coming notion 4 seems to be interested and Sibilius is not cheap

Check out the new Sibelius First 7. It’s really good (I’ve been trialling it) and it’s about $100. Hopefully I’ll get around to Rewiring it with Cubase and see what kind of integration there might be with that.