C12 - An update : trial finally available again. Still two remaining concerns…

Cubase
, ,
1

Hi all,

I have been ready to test C12 with the Trial version, mainly for the new ‘MIDI Remote’ feature. Problem is that I can’t do so : here is what is displayed in MySteinberg account, ‘Steinberg Licensing products’ pane :

MySteinberg_C12Trial
MySteinberg_C12Trial2129×474 22.4 KB

Actually, I never had the time to install it and test it thoroughly. But yes, it is ‘expired’… :roll_eyes:

So, as I’m no longer allowed to test C12, few questions :

  • I have read here and there a while ago that installing C12 on a system with C11.0.41 and eLicenser dongle already installed could break the existing licence - Actually, that’s why I postponed the trial installation after its download, while I was looking at clear instruction about how to install it. the Has this been reliably solved ?
  • I also have read that there are few VSTis bundled in C11 which are no longer present in C12. Do the existing already installed will be kept and able to work with C12 ?
  • Finally, and this is mainly why I am considering the upgrade, does the new MIDI Remote feature cope RELIABLY with NRPN controller messages, unlike the previous Generic Remote implementation ?

And when I talk about NRPN messages, I mean these (from an endless knob of my Akai MPD32, set at MSB : 000 and LSB : 052 address) :

C99 -> 0
C98 -> 52
C96 -> 1 (incr) / C97 -> 1 (decr)
C99 -> 127
C98 -> 127

which are compliant with the MIDI 1.0 standard and recognized as such by the Steinberg MIDI monitor used as a MIDI insert.

Thanks for any precision…

2

Maybe you can request an additional time period for the trial?

3

The installation of Cubase itself does not break any license. On the first one or two days of the C12 release there were some problems because of server overload, where licenses were temporarily unavailable. This is long fixed. Just follow the instructions for updating on the Steinberg website.

You can copy them from the old installation folder to the new one. There are several threads here about it, like this:

4

Why not, but how to proceed ? :thinking:

5

Thanks ! Your answer is rather reassuring. :slightly_smiling_face:

Now, for the NRPN messages : I can’t believe that no one is using endless knobs on their MIDI controllers, using them. How things are managed, in this case ?

6

MIDI Remote in Cubase 12 supports NRPN. Personally I prefer the encoders to send relative values. There are a few different standards, but in a nutshell, turning your endless encoder clockwise—it sends a “+1”, turning it counterclockwise—the encoder sends a “-1”.
The +1/-1 are actually regular MIDI CC and their values depend on what standard is used.

This page in the manual might be of interest.

7

Ask the support…

8

Thanks for this… :slightly_smiling_face:
Yep, it seems that NRPN messages are more or less managed, but the help page (and the implementation) is not very clear, as too often… To be precise about the messages involved, here is what I get in MIDI Monitor (used as a MIDI insert) when I turn the first knob of the MPD32 slightly to the right, then to the left.

EndlessKnob1_NRPN_MDIMonitor
EndlessKnob1_NRPN_MDIMonitor800×1002 44.2 KB

I would like to know if the MIDI Remote feature is now able to NATIVELY recognize these messages and bind them to a given Cubase command. Presently, I am using a clonky Generic Remote definition that uses regular messages recognition (the NRPN implementation in the Generic Remote feature has never worked…) with knobs made distinctive by BOTH their MIDI channel and the CC96/97 incr/decr part of the message, instead of the LSB/MSB, as it should. This implies to define 2 controllers in it for each knob :

EndlessKnob1_NRPN_GenericRemoteDefinition
EndlessKnob1_NRPN_GenericRemoteDefinition970×768 43.2 KB

It’s the only way I found to make my MPD32 usable for nudging, browsing or zooming tasks, among others. It’s much more convenient for me doing it this way than having to grab the mouse, cautiously using the scrollbars, or remembering countless predefined key commands. So, I would like to know how this can be done with the new MIDI Remote feature in a more elegant way, seeing the options available on the help page that you indicated me.

9

Just done…
Let’s see how things will go, but the process is not reassuring : after having fill the Support form with my inquiry and validate it, I got a blank screen with no acknowledgement of any kind… :face_with_raised_eyebrow:

10

As I was expecting it, the first ticket hasn’t been successful, but I made a second one and got the nice surprise, at the beginning of this month, to see that the trial has been reactivated until its end. So, I installed Cubase 12 and have been working with it since last 4th september. Few observations :

  • an absolutely flawless installation : I was expecting issues of all kinds. There has been none, Cubase 12 picking up all my C11 preferences perfectly. This with my C 11.0.41 installation still working as usual. A nice start…
  • I have read countless horror reports and stories about C12 crashes and unstability. Actually, I’m still waiting for the first crash on my end. Granted, I’ve been essentially working with the MIDI Remote feature, but still : this one is already quite stable, for a new ‘feature’.
  • The audio performance is more or less the same as C11. Sure, the dedicated meter is more ‘jumpy’, but it also doesn’t show the same thing.

Now, precisely about the MIDI Remote editor…

Seems like Steinberg still has some problems with NRPN messages : maybe I am missing something, but I’ve been unable to make the Remote editor recognize natively the messages sent by my MPD32 endless knobs. So, I had to find a workaround again… It’s this one (WIP) :

C12040_MIDIRemote_NRPN1
C12040_MIDIRemote_NRPN11464×1006 57.9 KB

C12040_MIDIRemote_NRPN2
C12040_MIDIRemote_NRPN21464×1006 57.1 KB

  • (in blue) : as with the Generic Remote definitions feature, two controls need to be defined for each knob, one for clockwise motions, the other for counter clockwise ones.
  • (in yellow) : in the same league, I had to keep a dedicated channel for each knob, as the actual parameter sent (in this case, CC53) is not recognized.
  • (in green) : only the ‘Standard’ value of the ‘Resolution’ parameter works. 14 bits (‘regular’ or ‘NRPN’) don’t. Beside this, three of the four available values of the ‘Value mod.’ parameter work : strangely, the ‘Relative binary offset’ doesn’t. Additionally, the ‘Value max.’ and ‘Value min.’ settings appear only if one of the two ‘14 bits’ resolution values is choosed. Why so ?

Overall, the MIDI Remote feature works and is able to cope with my two controllers, but obviously, there has been no progress in Steinberg headquarters about the NRPN messages management. Actually, I had to find almost exactly the same workaround for the MIDI Remote feature as I had to for the Generic Remote one : nearly ten years have passed, since… I would like to be proved wrong, so this is my first remaining question : has anyone been able to make the MIDI Remote feature work in a more elegant way with endless knobs ?

Beside this, yes, C12 works and I could make a good use of it. So, here is the second remaining question : if I purchase C12, will I be able to keep my present trial installation (with just a licence update), or will I have to uninstall/reinstall everything ?

Thanks for any answers… :slightly_smiling_face:

11

Forgive me…

I know next to little about the actual (MIDI Remote) subject, so am no help there sorry. However that part of your post struck me as though it really deserves its own thread.? But, up to you… :thinking: :slightly_smiling_face:

12

Yep, could be. But I already made threads concerning MIDI remote control of Cubase in the past, when the Generic Remote implementation was the main tool for this (see this one , in example).

Actually, I made this thread to know what C12 could bring on the subject, exposing what I was expecting from it. And I’ve been unable to install the trial version, at first, so, my last post was a kind of report, after finally been able to install and test it. Does it deserve its own thread ? I don’t really know, as there is also the C12 trial → licence purchase aspect in this one…

13

Sorry, I didn’t explain myself well… I meant, I thought just the ‘Midi Remote’ part of your last post struck me as deserving its own thread - the ‘second’ of your concerns; not the stuff about Trial version and licensing…

Regardless that you’ve previously posted on the matter, it seems (your concern is) absolutely relevant to this ‘new’ functionality introduced at C12. It would attract better attention in its own thread…

14

Yep, you are probably right, after all… Stay tuned ! :wink:

15

There are some hot discussions about the MIDI remote feature around. Maybe it’s worth to join…

16

Yep, but as they are not precisely about NRPN messages management (transmitted by endless knobs of a MIDI controller), I created my own one from tests done with the C12 trial version. So, I’m waiting, in it, for any advice from either users or Steinberg crew member… :slightly_smiling_face:

Beside this, I still would like to know if an unistall/reinstall process is needed if I take the plunge and purchase a ‘regular’ C12 licence, after having used the trial one, or just a licence update could suffice. The expiration date is next 30th september…

17

I think there should be no reinstall necessary if you tested the pro version and purchased the same. Only the license changes.

Maybe a moderator like @Martin.Jirsak or @steve can answer this.

18

Hi,

I can confirm. It’s the very same application. No reinstallation needed.

19

@st10ss @Martin.Jirsak

Good to know, thanks. It will prevent me from an useless hassle, as it seems that I have already a functional setup here, with C12.

The problem is that no option appear to purchase a ‘regular’ licence, either in the Steinberg Activation Manager or directly in MySteinberg account. In SAM, I get this (no ‘Purchase’ button of any kind, just one to unactivate it) :

Steinberg_SAM&C12
Steinberg_SAM&C12882×620 29.6 KB

So, I’m rather lost at this point. Thanks for any added enlightment…

20

Following my previous post : I took the plunge and purchased the C12 update. This, to keep a functional Cubase version VST 2.4 compatible and allowing its use without the eLicenser USB key to work with it. I 'll describe the process, as maybe it could help anyone who installed the C12 Trial version without any clue about how to purchase the ‘regular’ one, as there is not (AFAICS) a single document about how to proceed…

So, not seeing any way to update, I went in the Steinberg site and directly manage to purchase the update (after having to go into the process to retrieve my password) and used this one (with trembling hands - I really wasn’t at ease at this point, wondering about my C11 licence, and Echanger Download Access Code means absolutly nothing in decent french. So, I just guessed that it was the way to go to activate my licence purchase) :

MySteinberg_Products
MySteinberg_Products1089×450 32.5 KB

This done, and after entering the DAC received by e-mail, I immediatly unactivate, first, the Trial version (“version d’essai”) and, second, activated the other one and got the following screenshot, in SAM (Steinberg Activation manager) :

SAM_Cubase12Trial&Purchased
SAM_Cubase12Trial&Purchased884×621 45.4 KB

So, I guess that everything is good, but I’ll be sure of this only after next 30th september, as nothing in C12 allows me to know if I’m still using the trial version or the purchased one. Just hope that I won’t have to reinstall everything next 1st october…

I can’t resist to make an added comment, at this point : hovering the mouse near the red button in the SAM window, I stumbled on this very well hidden option (the cart with the blue background) which would have probably allowed me to purchase the C12 update directly from the trial version, instead of scratching my head about how to proceed. This is typically the kind of thing, that complicates things uselessly. No wonder that there are so many inquiries/threads in the forums concerning licences management, with this kind of implementation…

I shouldn’t go further, but still… Would it also be so complicated to centralize everything related to licencing (Cubase AND the related contents) in one and JUST ONE tool to ease the licences and download/installed items management ? :roll_eyes:

All this said, and this is my remaining concern, I would still like to have reports/explanations about this one…