Can anyone think of a way to eq several MIDI chs?

Cubase
1

Let’s say you have 5 MIDI chs with data, triggering 5 different VIs. You want to eq all of them equally; you want to add a bit of high end to all of them simul. You cant add an eq to the instrument track, b/c there are other VIs on that instr. track which you do not want to eq. You cant add them to some other “group” ch (as with audio) b/c no such thing exists for MIDI chs.

What I have been doing up until now is mixing those MIDI chs to audio, and adding eq to the audio ch. Can anyone think of a better way to go about doing this?

Thanks in advance.

2

You can use either VST Instrument Rack (F11) or Instrument Tracks. Adding a VSTi into the VST Instrument Rack creates one or more VST Instrument Audio Channels which can be routed to a Group Channel. See the Inspector Panel to set the routing. On the VSTi Rack you should activate as many audio outputs from the given VSTi as you need in other to separate the voices and be able to treat them individually.

Regarding the Instrument Tracks, you can route them into a Group Channel as well. However, in this case the routing cannot be set on the Inspector Panel and you should use the Mixer instead: right-click on the Mixer and choose Window->Show Routing View. Find the Instrument Tracks in the Mixer, look at the top of the mixer window and set the audio outputs there.

I think this is quite a good solution, however, if you wish to apply the same audio processing to several VSTi Audio Channels, then just route them into one Group as I described and this should make the trick for you.

Best regards

Miloslav

3

Thanks for the reply.

Sorry, but I dont follow you.

"You can use either VST Instrument Rack (F11) or Instrument Tracks. Adding a VSTi into the VST Instrument Rack creates one or more VST Instrument Audio Channels which can be routed to a Group Channel. "

It seems you are explaining to me something that is not applicable to my situation. How does adding a vsti to the instr rack and create a vst instr ch help me with the MIDI data that is already triggering a VI?

“Regarding the Instrument Tracks, you can route them into a Group Channel as well.”

Not sure how that helps either. Why would I need to route an instr ch to a group ch?

I appreciate you trying to help, but I really dont follow.

Thanks. :slight_smile:

4

MIDI is not audio. So you cannot apply an equalizer to a MIDI channel. The only option is to apply an equalizer to the audio outputs coming out of your VSTi.

And what I wanted to explain is that these VSTi audio outputs can be handled in the same way as ordinary audio tracks.

Is it clearer now? :wink:

Miloslav

5

Hey vasolim, click on one of his mucis links. He’s a “little” more advanced than you give him credit. :wink: An easy mistake to make, at first glance. :laughing:

6

Yes, I am aware of all of this, thank you. I have been doing MIDI orchestrations for about 15 years. I am pretty sure I made everything clear in my initial post.

I was just wondering if someone had thought of something that I haven’t.

Cheers.

7

perhaps you guys are talking about the same just in other words?

@Jeff: how do you mix those midi channels to audio?

if you have 4 midi channels (triggering each an individual VSTi)
then you get also for 4 audio channels, one for each VSTi
now how do you merge/mix these in a new audio-track? over 4 sends to an extra audio track?
Or you make a group channel track where you route the 4 audio signals of the 4 VSTi’s?

Anyway, however you do it, As far as I understood you, just could just put an EQ on the extra-audio track or groupChannel… that’s what miloslav meant…

Now if i understood you too wrong, please add a screenshot of your setup and explain perhaps with circles or numbers what you want to do…

8

@Jeff: how do you mix those midi channels to audio?

Export Audio Mixdown

Here’s the thing - broken down even more.

Let’s say I load an instance of Kontakt, and load one instrument in that instance. I create one MIDI ch, route it to that K instrument, and write some MIDI data. That audio that is being triggered by the MIDI ch, gets routed out of Kontakt to the VST Instr Ch, and then out the master bus. If I want to , let’s say, eq that output, I can insert an eq on that VST Instr Ch. Ok, works fine. If I have several instances of Kontakt loaded in the VST Instr rack, and want them all to have the same eq, I can route all of those VST Instr Chs to a Group Ch, and insert an eq on that Group Ch. Ok, works fine.

But let’s say that each instance of Kontakt has several instruments - which is pretty much the standard way of working. In K-1, I have 16 chs of Violins, and in K2, I have 16 chs of Violas. I have four MIDI chs - there is MIDI data triggering K-1 MIDI chs 1 and 3, and MIDI data triggering K-2, MIDI chs 2 & 4. What I want to do is eq K-1 MIDI ch 1, and eq K-2 MIDI ch 4. If I insert an eq on either or both of the VST Instr Chs, then ALL of the instruments in both Kontakt instances get the eq - don’t want that. So:

Option #1 - open the Kontakt instrument and eq there. I gave an example of just two MIDI chs that need audio, but if there are many, this is not logistically practical. Plus, if any of these Kontakt instances happen to be on slaves, all the more reason why this is not logistically practical. Furthermore, the Kontakt eq is not all that flexible, and to be quite honest, not very good. So, Option 1 is a no-go.

Option #2 - Mixdown those MIDI chs to audio, mute those MIDI chs and/or events, and insert an eq on that audio ch. This works fine, but I was looking to see if anyone has come up with another method, so as to bypass the mixdown process.

Yes, I know MIDI is not audio. But what would be nice, is to be able to route specific MIDI chs somewhere - maybe pre-VST Instr Ch - so that fx can be applied to those MIDI chs without affecting others on the same VST Instr Ch. Ok, how to do this if MIDI is not audio? I dont know - I am just thinking out loud here.

Cheers.

9

Because then you can apply an equalizer to that Group channel. From what I understood, this is what you were after.

Sorry, Jeff, I didn’t mean to offend you in any way. But your wording “to eq a MIDI channel” was very misleading for me.

Best regards

Miloslav

10

Hey - no offens taken. I apprecite the time.

“But your wording “to eq a MIDI channel” was very misleading for me.”

Yeah - I can understand that. Shoulda worded it a bit differently.

Cheers.

11

“K1 has 16 chnls violin”

If you choose to load a 16 ch instance of K and activate all the outs you get a VSTi channel for each MIDI channel. Route these as desired.

12

OK…
Kontakt explains the issue better and was the cause for possible misunderstandings.

I know this suggestions is CPU-conccerning neither ideal, but comes closer to what you need:
Make as many Kontakt instances as you have instruments you like to treat individually, or try to route the Kontakt signals to different Audio-channels (don’t know if that’s possible).
I think that’s the best option you have, because Kontakt as far as I know merges the audio signals in the internal mixer. to one Cubase audio channel (or am I wrong?).
So just make 4 Kontakt instances. If you don’t want to use Kontakt internal mixer, the use Cubase as a mixer but accept cubase restrictions (4 separate instruments)…
I think that’s by farest the best way to go… like this you don’t have to work with audio-exports.

Best way would be off course to route Kontakt signals to different audio channels
…
@mashed: Off course you’re right… the 16ch Kontakt is the solution (haven’t played with that one yet…)

13

Jeff, I think here is the point: you presume that each instance of Kontakt has just one VSTi Audio Output. But you can activate more than one audio output for one instance of Kontakt inserted into the VSTi Rack. And, if you set the Kontakt so that each input MIDI channel is assigned its dedicated output audio channel, then you have the full audio-processing control over the individual voices of your composition.

Isn’t this what you want?

Yes, that’s what I meant. Of course, Kontakt can have multiple audio outputs and you can set the routing inside of Kontakt.

–
Miloslav

14

Ok, so, use the 16 op K4.dll, to have 16 different VST Instr Chs? I load that .dll, and still only get 1 VST Instr Ch. Ok, maybe I am doing something wrong.

In any event, the REAL issue is VE Pro. I have 32 chs of MIDI - all on one VST Instr Ch - cant split those off.

Cheers.

15

Did you enable all the outs in the Instrument Rack? :confused:

16

Hi,

Mashedmitten and vasolim have already given you the answer but just to try and make it clear, I’ll have a go also.

  1. Load Kontact 8 or 16 out in the VST Instruments window (F11)
  2. Just to the left of the instrument name in the VST Instruments window there is a ‘button’ that looks like a square with a right facing arrow. Click on that button and you should see a list of available outputs. Select any outputs you want from that list, they will appear in the mixer.
  3. Add whatever fx you want to the VSTi outputs you’ve just created.

This is the same for all multi-out VSTi’s. By default, when you first load one Cubase only activates the first output, you need to explicitly activate any others that you need.

I’ve got to say, please don’t take offence, your original question was very confusing.

HTH,
Mark

EDIT: If VE Pro (I don’t know it) is also capable of multi-outs it’ll be the same procedure.

17

Ah, ok I see.

Thanks for the responses, and yes - that would be the way to do it - IF you have everything set up that way in advance. I am not trying to be difficult here, but if you…ah, well - I’ll just leave well enough alone.

Cheers.

18

Time to redo all your templates. :yes:

19

Hi Jeff, nice to see you here.

If I understand correctly what you are saying (and I might not be), you might give this a try.

  1. Create an FX track with the EQ that you want.
  2. Create a new VSTi for each instrument that has midi channels you want to EQ.
  3. Go to the midi tracks and re-assign them to the new VSTi that you have created.
  4. Assign the Output of the VSti’s (pseudo) audio track to the FX channel.

Hope that helps!

[edit- still a novice at some of this stuff, but I don’t see a way to do it if you keep it all on one VSTi]

20

Heya John! :smiley:

AHA! That’s a pretty darn good answer. Problem is, that method is more time consuming than simply mixing down to audio and inserting an eq. :laughing:

But thanks for the idea!

Cheers.