This update causes some of the VST2’ plugins to be displayed wrong. The frame of the VST can be put elsewhere then the actual window of the VST is the left corner of the screen. I did not have this problem with version 11.0.30. I will try to switch back to this version to see if the problem disappears.
I did some research and it all has to do with… yes again HiDPI under Cubase 11. When I switch this off the projects with the VST’s are displaying good again. Note that when I switched to back to 11.0.30 certain VST2’s still were drawn out of line (as described). Disabling HiDPI in Cubase 11.0.30 did fix this problem. However it is the lack of support at Steinberg that they postpone this problem to be fixed in Cubase 12 (which we all will pay the price for). This problem with HiDPI is there from the beginning Steinberg introduced it in Cubase. It is time to get serious and really listen to the users in this community and beyond and fix this problem for all the versions (10… 12) Steinberg introduced it in. The video engine of Cubase is still not working good enough. I switched back to 11.0.40 with HiDPI switched OFF and then it works as expected (except I can not use the HiDPI mode but that’s OK with me). There is another problem with the Video interface (even in not in HiDPI mode) and that is that it not always draws certain VST2’s correctly, only after opening, closing and again opening a VST2 instrument interface those instruments are displayed correctly.
I have uploaded the screens with a problem that I have when HiDPI within Cubase is switched on or off. This is with one of my plugins called Transfuser 2 from Air Music (Latest version for windows 10 2021). At first the plugin does not show its under half. When clicking on the VST control on the track to let it dissappear and reclicking it the window as it should is shown. This problem has always been there since the time Cubase implemented their own Video/Screen engine.
With the Hybrid plugin (also used in this project), yesterday after the upgrade to 11.0.40 the Hybrid plugins frame was drawn in the middle of the screen and the plugins controls were at the left-corner of the screen but only when in Cubase HiDPI was on. Now this is working correctly even with HiDPI on, but I must say that I have switched the HiDPI settings in Windows itself to off because I want to have speed in my drawings and I notice in everything that “scales” slows down somehow the drawing screens (not only in Cubase).
Now your questions:
I only have seen it sofar with AIR Music plugins (Transfuser2, Hybrid 2) and the ARP2600 of WayOutWare software.
The plugins of Air Music and WayOutWare are only VST2 plugins. I have not noticed the behavior with VST3 plugins, but I do not have VST3 versions of these plugins, because they are not there.
Yes I have tried the option as shown in the first screen shot of Transfuser2, it does not help.
Well sometimes the Video Engine just hangs (showing no differences in screen but when playing a project the music keeps on playing and after a while the screen gets updated again. This is since Cubase started to use its own video engine/screen engine. I see also glitches when updating the position pointer on the project window. As described in a lot of complaints on the forum, sometimes there are thin hair-lines or some kind of shadows behind letters or waveforms. I do not know what it is causing this but it must be Cubase own video/screen driver that does this, because “Live” and even the free “Cakewalk by Bandlab” do not have these kind of problems. Also with these programs all the VSTs are drawn correctly, no problems with that either. So why is that Steinberg has still problems with the basics of Windows programming, e.g. screen drawings and that other vendors don’t have this kind of problems?
Also I still dislike the fact that if you click outside a Cubase window (e.g. on another program or just on the desktop) that all open VST windows whether it are VST2 or VST3 windows just disappear. How can you ever drag and drop for instance wave forms from another project into a VST the right way when the VST disappears (you can not drop on windows that disappear). Only when dragging and dropping within Cubase windows itself (CUBASE) on top work drag and drop works as expected. This I found annoying from every edition of Cubase. Never have this kind of strange non-like windows behavior with other DAWs. It is still for all the nice settings that Cubase provide to make the sound right that I still use Cubase but for using any kind of VST plugins (and even DXi and VST2 32bit and 64bit plugins) I now use “Cakewalk by Bandlab” more often then I use Cubase for that reason.
So there are a lot of things that should be fixed in todays release and not on upgrades that you have to pay a lot for. Look at the competitors and even ask them how they do things. Cakewalk by Bandlab is free and they do a very very nice job in improving and expanding their Music Engine. Steinberg is not alone on this world, keep your eyes open!
To me this sounds like a typical rendering issue with OpenGL that several VST2 plugins have. I would suggest you report this bug to WayOutWare software. Hopefully that motivates them to ideally move to VST3 which is compatible with HiDPI.
These are typical answers from Steinberg, no in depth research of what is going on here.
As described I will use other DAWs that work right with VST’s and with Cubase I will use HOSTING VST implementations that handle the plugins of 3rd party (non-Steinberg) well within Cubase using those VSTs as a gateway to other VSTs. The bugs of not handling the screens of certain VST directly from within CUBASE not right is definitely only to blame on the Cubase implementation and not by those VSTs. How can Steinberg explain that other DAWs do not show these kind of problems with the same VSTs that are causing screen problems within Cubase?
The other problem I mentioned of all open VST windows to disappear off the screen or screens when I click outside a VST window that is handled by CUBASE or when I click on my desktop screen is very annoying and has nothing to do OpenGL or something like that. This is certain no windows-like behaviour and I hope that it can be fixed (normal behaviour is that open VST screens are still on my screen when I click outside an open Cubase window).
On which DAWs does your plugin work? With which settings? Are the windows created as HiDPI-Aware or not? We would like to be able to reproduce this ourselves and identify whether our hypothesis is correct or not.
Unfortunately I am not responsible for the video engine and cannot answer to this question myself but I forwarded it.
My troubles with not drawing the VST windows right were the most strange in HiDPI mode. For some VST windows the outside frame of the window was correctly dwawn in the place I last saved my project but the inside of the frame was drawn in the left-corner of the screen.
And with the plugin called “Transfuser-2” from Air Music Technology the edit window of the plugin is never drawn both in HiDPI mode as well in normal mode. I must close the GUI of that plugin to make Cubase draw it right.
The other DAWs that I use that do not have this problem with the GUI’s of the VSTs in both HiDPI mode as well in normal mode are:
“LIVE 11” by Ableton
“Waveform 11” by Tracktion
“Cakewalk by Bandlab” / former called SONAR
“Reason” from propellerhead (latest edition)
Also I do notice that at certain times some VST’s GUI’s are redrawn by Cubase creating first a white window on the place where a plugin is located and then draws the VST GUI again. It results when playing or recording that I see at those time a flickering white on the screen because of the redrawing. Also in the other mentioned DAW’s I do not have this problem.
Our tester took the time to test Transfuser-2 on several DAWs.
We can confirm that sometimes the GUI isn’t drawn on the bottom half. To me, this is back to the problem I already mentioned during my first post. This is likely due to an issue with OpenGL and Air Music Technology should fix it, and ideally consider porting to VST3 which fully encompasses the HiDPI workflow. Let us know how we could assist here.
Additionally, here is a brief overview of some of the competitors mentioned. With Tracktion we experimented bigger problems with this plugin, and much more with other plugins. Are you aware of a settings we’re not aware of? The plugin is small and layouts are broken:
Ableton Live 11 does not seem to be HiDPI-Aware. The main application just uses internal rescaling but the application is not HiDPI-Aware. The Plugins that we opened so far on Ableton Live were all blurry and their windows were HiDPI-Unaware. For instance here Fabfilter. Left is Ableton Live and Right is Cubase. Are you aware of an option that we aren’t aware of eventually?
Overall, Transfuser-2 seems very unstable on several DAWs. We recommend once again that you directly get in touch with them.
Thanks for getting back to me on the Transfuser-2 subject. I will pass the problem also to Air Music. With the Transfuser-2 software I have no problems when using it (after an closing and opening it again of it in Cubase).
I do think that building the screens and display the screens however in Cubase is different then the ones used by other DAWs. When using Cubase, at random intervals, I see that open VST windows are redrawn by Cubase resulting in first a white BOX (the flickering I see) of the open VST screens and then the VST image is drawn again. This happens with all of my VST’s that I have including the Steinberg build-in VST’s.
Also Cubase is the only DAW that hides all open VST windows when navigating elsewhere out of any Cubase windows. I wish there was a setting there to turn this behaviour off and maybe it is also related to that redrawing of VST windows at random intervals.
So I am still not happy about the fact that Cubase is not conistent with normal window behaviour and that when drawing a VST it doesn’t take the time long enough to fully drawn the GUI of a VST even when it is related to the use of an openGL libarary. Why is the Transfuser-2 fully drawn by Cubase when it is closed and then opened again? I can not explain this.
Very likely because of an outdated OpenGL rendering strategy and because once again the proper handling of HiDPI requires interfaces only available in VST3 that developers have to maintain. This is valid for every DAW. Again as you could see it seems that Fabfilter is not HiDPI aware on Ableton Live. It is not because a window is properly rendered in another DAW that this window is properly declared as HiDPI. In our benchmarking Cubase is really not the worst player when it comes to trying to deal with VST 2 plugins on a hybrid HiDPI environment. And there is definitely no flawless player, it’s impossible as long as the manufacturers wouldn’t have moved to VST3.
"Always on top"works only when you click inside Cubase. When you click somewhere outside the program ALL open VST windows just disappear. I even have the same result when clicking inside a VST window that open a the Windows File Explorer. If the Windows File Explorer open all open VST window just disappear. How can you then easily drop and drag to an open VST window.
So how can I make this normal Windows behaviour, just always let the open VST windows open even when you click OUTSIDE the CUBASE program.
On Mac at least, when you drag a file from Finder to Cubase the vst window appears again after a second or so and you can drop on it.
Maybe it is the same with Windows. Did you try waiting a bit after you drag?
Hello. Fabfilter works great in Ableton in HDPI mode! I got both. Cubase and Ableton. And I need to say, that Ableton works amazing on Windows in HDPI. You can scale it as you want and all looks smoothly and clear. Regarding Cubase honestly it’s so buggy! And it’s not regarding the third party plugins. I am talking now about stock Cubase graphic issues! Stock! And it makes me sadly. Come one, Steinberg! The end of 2021 is here! I was added another graphic issues on my topic here:
So far all our tests show that the plugins are not HiDPI aware on Ableton. The app itself is also not HiDPI aware. They are rescaling everything internally and not using the API offered by Windows. The 3rt part plugins seem to all be rendered LoDPI. We’re happy to be proven wrong but here’s a the screenshot, left is Ableton, right is Cubase:
I agree that Cubase isn’t flawless in this regard. We are aware of it, it takes more time and focus to revamp the entire GUI than we initially planned. Always keep in mind that we don’t have unlimited resources and that any time spent on HiDPI means less time for other long-awaited features. I cannot promise anything but an iterative process here, from one version to the other.
Cubase performs all in all comparatively fine next to other competitors when it comes to handling HiDPI. We are regularly testing most of competitors and they all come with pros and cons. So far we are not aware of any competitor that is truly HiDPI-Aware and has solved every internal and external issues. I wouldn’t mind admitting that there is one, but we are not aware of it so far. Cubase offers a balanced compromise between two worlds here and shouldn’t be branded as the bad pupil of the class every week.
To future posters: I would really like to stop being confronted every week with claims of this sort. A closer look at every corner of every app will show you that competitors aren’t flawless as it is often claimed here. We welcome any bug report, we do, but as long as it is specific and that the discussion doesn’t fall into rhetorical scapegoating.