This is funny to me. When you purchased Cubase you did in fact sign on as a BETA tester.
What PRO in his right mind would even load up a .ZERO version of a DAW and expect no problems?? Ive been on Cubase since SX1, it’s been the same with EVERY release. SX1,SX2,SX3, C4, C5, C6, C7 and now C8. Carry on 
7.5.3 for me, C8 is parked for the time being. all clients happy here.
For sure, it’s called “curiosity killed the cat” 
The thing though is, that people will start voting with their wallet. For me personally, this has been the release that feels most hurried. If Steinberg do it like this a few more times, I might become less curious to what’s up with a new release. And even though I might then buy the new version by the time it’s on version dot two or so, that does mean for Steinberg that the cash comes in later, which will change the funding dynamics of their development process.
100%. Hence my suggestion to be more open about the dot zero release being a beta. I’m open for alternatives too, as long as it makes it more transparent.
I don’t think I stated that software should be bug free at release, check out what I wrote? However, it is my feeling that this release feels more hurried than others, and I’ve gone through a good few by now. That the current state of Cubase 8 Pro makes me feel it’s closer to beta than gold… However, Steinberg sell it like a gold release.
I’m in “computerland” too, and I can tell you that in my part of the land, this release would have made heads roll.
And while the software that provides me my day-job is mission-critical, it’s not life-critical… but for life-critical items like cars, planes, pharma, I think that it’s safe to assume that the ‘depth’ of testing is orders of magnitude larger than Steinberg have ever undertaken.
However, even in non-life-critical items I’m sure that consumers seem to expect less of a piece of software than say a half-nice sweater (like one at the same price as the upgrade from 7.5 to 8.0). If that would come with an obvious defect, most of us would bring it back to the store. Another example would be that steak in the restaurant that you ordered medium-rare, but you got served well done… are you going to chew through the buggy piece of meat, or are you going to send it back?
So, that’s the point: I ordered Cubase 8.0 Pro (not Cubase 8.0 Pro Beta), and it doesn’t feel finished. No, I don’t need to get a refund, and I know that Steinberg will fix the large majority of the multitude of niggles that make it feel closer to beta than gold.
Sure, but that wasn’t the discussion. The discussion was that this release felt hurried.
Cubase will never be made to measure (although it’s a highly configurable piece of software), so that’s a bad comparison. Cubase should fit off the peg, that’s what I expect when I buy the product that’s not marked as beta but at times feels close to it.
A car being slower than the advertised speed is a ‘bug’ if you want to call it like that. There’s consumer protection for that type of stuff.
If the car is equally as fast, or faster than the advertised speed, but not fast enough to your liking, that’s not a bug, it’s an enhancement that the user would like.
In my case, Cubase feeling more like beta than gold is like the first case, not the second. I hope you meant that too, if you meant it more like the second case, then your definition of ‘bugs’ is a strange one in my part of the computerland (I’m in the computerwelt area myself ).
Regards,
characterstudios
I’m pretty sure I did not do that, but let me know if I missed something?
Regards,
characterstudios
Sure, but that wasn’t the discussion. The discussion was that this release felt hurried.
I don’t see any more new DAW bugs than usual, less if anything are being reported.
If you say Cubase Pro was not ready or hurried then that’s just an opinion to those who have their systems going and they don’t see anything specific. Others are not telepathic.
IF you have a specific bug then report it in the proper place. This is ok for initial report and steam-letting but if it’s not specific it’s not going to be attended to very quickly.
And if non-specific complaints go on and on with no clear goal other than to rant it tends to get old rather fast.
You say problems with the MCU. (I think, if it wasn’t you mentioned it, someone else did) Have you taken it up in the Issues department? There’s a case for “General” becoming specific after a time.
POGOTP.
quote - New versions have to be treated with caution. I wish this advice was a sticky for new users though.
(they would not make sales)
quote - It pays to wait for the demo while one works out from reviews and reports what new bits of hardware might be needed to make it all work.
(they would not make sales)
quote - If you pay for the program before the demo is ready or you have tried it, sorry, but you are a beta tester.
(then it should be priced at a beta introductory price AND labelled as such passing a beta off as RTU is outright lying)
(but then again they would not make sales)
the best and honest solution is START DEVELOPMENT EARLIER HAVE IT READY FOR THE PROJECTED RELEASE DATE!
if you must release beta at least be honest enough to say so. customers can then make an informed decision.
i feel i have been duped by the company i trusted. are customers supposed to realize and accept as default that new versions are not ready/stable/working? if that happens then:
(they definitely wont make many sales)
i have no problem sticking with 7.5 and will wait in future to buy any upgrades as im sure many will after this fiasco.
(early adopters im sure are just people who havent learned to wait till its somewhat debugged. reminds me of the old saying “its like taking candy from a baby”) well…babies learn fast!
your reputation is the foundation of ANY business and should be protected at all costs.
This was my path to Cubase 8 Pro:
1997or98 Cubase VST 3.7> 2000 Cubase VST 4 24> 2001 Cubase VST 5 32> 2003 Cubase SX3
2007 Cubase 4> 2011 Cubase 6 then 6.5> 2015 Cubase 8 Pro…so you see, somewhere i
waited even between few complete new Versions and it was all the same as now.
So no Demo or Waiting helps, its Steinberg, lets accept the facts…it was always Beta
even after 14xxxx releases and versions. As soon as they fixed it the new Beta came in.
Of course…paid Beta.
Simple question.
If C8 could have used “3 to 6 more months in the oven” to be ready (in whoever’s opinion), why didn’t you just wait 3 to 6 months to get it?
Just use what you had for a while and get C8 later. If you think it’s “always a beta”, just let others “beta test” it and tippy toe in later. Impotent ranting is really not going to fix anything. It’s just not.
Sorry for those having major issues. Happy for those (which is most) who are not!
Use what works. Get stuff done.
Seems they’re selling an awful lot of “beta” versions to buyers who must KNOW they’re beta versions because they’ve bought so many “beta” versions before apparently.
Now I don’t mind NEW users complaining but the phrases “Once bitten…” and “Won’t get fooled again.” come to mind. How come some still are? (getting bitten and fooled) Again and again. Five minutes after release.
Step AWAY from the BUY button! Drop the credit card! Put your hands on the keyboard and use the version that works. You KNOW it’s a paid beta because “that’s Steinberg” so best let fools like me buy it first.
If you have never had a version that works why is this the fifth version you have bought? 
All the early buyers just have a software form of G.A.S. ( Gear Acquisition Syndrome ) 
I’ve read the writing on the wall and as a Cubase PC user I just downloaded 7.5.3
Many Mac users stated they had no issues, seems to be us PC users with the most CB 8 issues.
PS- I installed 8.0.5 on a fresh OS Win7 64 with a new SSD
I have to say that it amazes me how many people need to come and tell us in this thread that we’re completely wrong to expect software to be released in a more stable state. Two things about that:
- If it works for you, go make music with it. What are you still doing in this thread anyway, do you have Steinberg/Yamaha shares, and are you afraid of your shares taking a tumble? I mean, why else would you continue to come here and lambast people for having a different opinion than you? Be assured that our opinion on the quality of this release will not be adjusted by the fact that it works fine for you.
- More seriously though, it’s due to consumers like you that manufacturers get away with releasing software in this state, and selling it as a full release, instead of beta. Apparently this is completely normal and acceptable for many.
Regards,
characterstudios
There is a reason you and I are using Cubase. Its a bargain for what you get.
Pro tools is the industry standard. Cubase is used by many main stream professional musicians, composers, etc. because it works very well, has many features that Pro Tools users must pay for separately, but Pro Tools is the industry standard.
There are bugs in all large software applications, including Pro tools, but pro tools is the industry standard.
During his acceptance speaches for his Grammys, Oscars, and Golden Globles, Hans Zimmer who used Cubase in all those projects, always mentions that Pro Tools is the industry standard.
Did I mention that Pro Tools is the industry standard??? 
Great (for you)!
I’m not asking others to be telepathic, or experience the same issues as I have. I’m not asking for anything from other users, not even empathy. I’m asking Steinberg to release software in a better state, or mark it as beta instead. Except for being delighted for them, I couldn’t care less about other users that have no problems.
And you’re right, it’s an opinion, problem is that you don’t seem to treat it like that, because you keep on telling me what I should and shouldn’t do?
Huh? Apparently you really have trouble understanding what this thread is about: The software feels hurried, there are many (many!) little niggles, and some bigger ones. There’s no need to be specific about that in this thread, the discussion is actually about the whole picture. It’s not about single bugs, it’s about the amount of them, and Steinberg releasing the software in a state that seems closer to beta than gold.
Wasn’t me, no MCU here. But I feel for those folks.
Regards,
characterstudios
-
Why do you constantly come here to bleat about 8 when you (presumably) have a perfectly good working earlier version while you wait for your issue to be fixed? Haven’t you got music to make?
-
More seriously though, I found the tone of the thread subject and some of the posts fairly obnoxious. As one of the mods pointed out in another thread, Cubase is coded by actual human beings (read their names in the About screen) , all no doubt fallible but working hard and bringing us class-leading features. As many others have pointed out, no software version is perfect right out of the gate, and anyone assuming so does need a reality check. Actually I found 8.0.0 amazingly usable for a very first version - some irritations and quirks for sure, but nothing showstopping. I was expecting to dip my toe in the water then retreat back to something more solid, but I never did. Try being a Pro Tools user if you want to experience something made by a company that really does not seem to care about its users, who let genuinely debilitating bugs drag on not for weeks or months, but years. I guesstimate it was 18 months til PT11 worked reliably with video playback - from Avid, market leaders in digital video. And still it randomly freezes for me from time to time. Oh, and if HD users don’t pay $600 every year, their licenses are frozen and can never be upgraded in the future.
How do you like them apples?
So sorry if not all of us are ready to whine and moan and whinge about their 82 euro upgrade. Do I want Cubase 8 better? Hell yeah. Can’t wait for VE Pro to work better for one, and lots of other niggles to be sorted. In answer to your question, that’s why I come here - there’s still work to be done, of course. But I’d rather catalogue these individual issues in the way that Steinberg wants, issue by issue, with replication instructions to give them a chance, nudge others to add their voice if they are affected by a particular gremlin. Rather than threads with obnoxious titles like this one, when many are using it perfectly well right from the get go (and I am sorry if that inconvenient fact irritates you). Think about it - how constructive is this thread really? What does it achieve beyond being a vague rant hoping others will join in and getting irked when they don’t?
Ach. Maybe the news this week has brought a bit of needed perspective. Reading things like “disappointed doesn’t even come close” when folks say that the mixer width isn’t always remembered when re-opening a project (when the fix is literally one click and drag away in the zoom dialog) seems rather silly - at best. Steinberg sure isn’t perfect - if I talked to them directly I’d probably not stop for a week about ideas I’d like to see for improvements. But I really do appreciate where we are now, where Cubase is next to their competitors, and mindful that the company is made of men and women with lives and families who are working hard to keep on pushing forward. A tiny bit of recognition of this and a slightly less combative approach from some here would probably be beneficial all round.
So from me to Steinberg - Cubase 8 Pro rocks, and thanks. And looking forward to it rocking even more.
And finally - why not. Je Suis Charlie.
Huh? Apparently you really have trouble understanding what this thread is about: The software feels hurried, there are many (many!) little niggles, and some bigger ones. There’s no need to be specific about that in this thread, the discussion is actually about the whole picture. It’s not about single bugs, it’s about the amount of them, and Steinberg releasing the software in a state that seems closer to beta than gold.
If there’s no specific niggles then what’s the point. Cubase is SOLID at this end and many others report a solid release as well.
I would say that it is a hard time to develop for components and systems and probably usage is moving along too so I’ll have to allow that I’m luckier than you are in my component choice and usage.
However, to dismiss another point of view and say the problem is of the “no need to be specific” variety then I’m afraid you might well be given short shrift for support on that ticket and all the thread will do is die of grizzling by those who don’t know what the fuss is about and those who say “there’s loads of problems!” without being able to outline anything even remotely specific when asked what’s up.
The software doesn’t feel hurried to me, it feels just like any other version. Newish, few teething problems (technical term used for new stuff) and a bug or two.
If you gave a few system details it might give others a clue as to what’s bothering you, and forum members, mods and devs might spot that you have a component or software that needs the odd tweak here and there.
Think about it - how constructive is this thread really? What does it achieve beyond being a vague rant hoping others will join in and getting irked when they don’t?
Yep.
- I don’t “constantly come here to bleat about 8” - check and read my post history please. I’m having a discussion in a thread that interests me, because I have a similar experience.
- Previous version is workable enough, but certainly not perfect.
- Still making music too.
Never said I expected perfect, actually pointed that out explicitly. I do expect better though. In regards to the actual human beings: Yes, that’s why we’re trying to have a discussion about this, it’s called communication. There’s no need to give additional thanks prior to having this discussion, I already gave thanks with my wallet when I bought 8.0.
You’re talking pears here. I am a regular PT user too, I’m very well aware of what’s going on in that space. But in no way is the state of PT an excuse for Steinberg. Also, I was clear to state that this Cubase release is the one that feels worse to me, compared to past experiences.
I appreciate that, but then again, you weren’t asked to whine with me. And that’s even assuming that I’m ‘whining’ - I don’t think I am, I think I’ve actually been pretty reasonable so far.
But this thread is not about fixing individual issues. It’s about the whole picture. Yes, we all have to work on communicating the issues the way Steinberg wants, I fully agree.
It doesn’t irritate me what-so-ever, not sure how you got that impression.
Seriously good point. Of course this thread could be constructive, I’ve already tried to discuss with others here how to improve this in the future: Official beta program, mark a release for what it is, transparency. It would be nice if we could discuss those points, instead of having to continuously be lambasted for even trying to talk about it.
This thread is about “Cubase being released early”. Points that I consider relevant/constructive to that topic are the following points:
- Yes, I agree, I feel the same.
- No, I don’t agree, I don’t feel the same.
- What can we agree on to do about it.
- What do we expect from Steinberg.
Points that I consider irrelevant/nonconstructive to that discussion are: - You’re whining.
- This is not a constructive discussion, we should just log single bugs.
- You’re crazy to expect it to be better.
I’d gladly talk about the relevant points, but what I see most is folks coming in and dismissing those points with the points I consider irrelevant. Although, I’m always willing to learn, so maybe you can logically explain why the latter 3 points would be relevant to this discussion?
While I agree with the sentiment of perspective, the logical conclusion is then that there should be no reason to lambaste people that want to discuss (what they consider to be) the relevant points to this topic? In fact, the perspective should have thought us that it’s fine to have people discuss the thing they want to discuss. You seem to be indicating that that might not be your opinion, in which case your last point could be considered to be hypocritical.
Regards,
characterstudios
Excellent for you and others. It’s not my experience. The point is that if you only discuss single bugs, you might miss addressing the bigger picture. This is a discussion about that bigger picture, and I’ve tried to have it in a positive way, but some keep coming back and tell me that I’m not allowed to have that discussion that way.
Maybe it’s luck. Maybe it’s usage.
I didn’t dismiss a point of view. But since when are single issues relevant to a discussion about overall quality? Discussing those single issues would only detract from discussing that bigger picture. Mind you too that the dismissing started with the thread-starter, others, myself being told that we shouldn’t have this discussion in the first place.
These are items I’ve brought up participating in threads about specific issues. I was trying to have a discussion with people that feel the same as I do about this release (or people that appreciate the discussion about overall quality/timing of release, and what can be done about it), even though they might have a different set of niggles to deal with.
Anyway, it’s clear that we’re divided on this, so probably not much use in continuing the discussion about how this should be approached. You don’t have the same issues, and as such your experience and frame of reference to have this discussion is different than mine. Based on that, your input has not been very relevant to the discussion I’m actually trying to have. I’ve tried to explain that, but it doesn’t seem to go anywhere, which is fine.
Respectfully, I’m not dismissing your viewpoints, they’re just irrelevant for the discussion I need to have. I’d gladly go for a beer with you one day and talk other topics
Regards,
characterstudios
There is not point of view here, its harsh facts. A guy who opens Cubase once a week
and creates 1 instrument track and plays with it can not tell some of us about bugs and
problems, people who make living with it or who use it 18 hours a day to the max.
Yea, works good for them? Great? That means they know nothing about nor they use it
as some others are using it…see then if bugs and problems don’t pop out.
I think anyone using MCU will disagree with you and say it’s definitely showstopping because they can’t use their hardware with C8. Yes, you can go back to 7.5. I’m sure it will be fixed…eventually. But again, IMO this issue is big enough to say “lets not release Cubase8 until we fix MCU…especially since we are calling it PRO.” Same goes for when they released C7…IMO just too many GUI issues with the mix console, and ZERO mix console key commands. These issues do not attract pro users. Of course like usual the the solution was to go back to C6.5.
For the casual or new user C8 might work fine. But why proclaim that when basic features like MCU don’t work? Just because it almost works fine for a user who isn’t using MCU doesn’t negate the title post of this topic…Cubase8 not ready for public release. It’s all a gray area about when something is ready for release, but IMO they passed that gray area by knowingly releasing it with MCU not working.
My point is, at some point this widely accepted concept “expect a .0 release that will have lots of bugs and don’t buy or use until .5” will only encourage Steinberg and other DAW builders to continue this pattern of releasing things they know don’t work, such as MCU. They won’t change that pattern until they see a decrease in .0 sales or continued negative feedback that harms their reputation. I would guess Yamaha is sensitive to both.
I find 8.0 to be amazingly encouraging because of focus on basic DAW functions, and workflow…even if all this stuff doesn’t work properly right now! VCA’s, render in place…all have problems. With the exception of Bass Amp, and Groove Agent improvements, they didn’t try to compete with 3rd parties. By 8.5 if Steinberg can overcome these huge obstacles, it’s going to be a great release. But they haven an awful lot to work on to make that happen. What I fear is a repeat of the past which is fix most but not enough issues before C9 is released.