Because the Cubase users WANTED it like that.
The first implementation of the automation system caused a big uproar on the Cubase forums because they simply didn’t understand it.
The forums were on fire, and after a series of polls, the users voted on masse for the old automation system, no matter how much we tried to explain that it was identical to using “write to end”.
Same for VCA’s. The new grouping feature set was very good, and was covering everything that was needed for music production., ut it wasn’t correct and good enough for audio post. Cubase users didn’t want the extra layer of complexity, so the request was granted to not change anything for the Cubase users.
I really don’t want to go into discussion about that, I have had my share of sh** trying to explain the differences.
I have learned that explaining stuff just makes things worse.
People want things the way they want them, and they tell you when they want them.
Anyway, the answer is: Because Steinberg has listened to their users.
this comment is rather inappropriate here, I think.
I have been in the professional audio business for 20+ years now. Since I switched from fairlight with Nuendo 4 I‘ve used Nuendo for almost all jobs I have been given the chance to participate in. I must say that I can‘t remember a software release ever to get so many basic things completely wrong as N8 and 8.1
I know that as a pro you must ALWAYS work around bugs or missing features.
But if an audio post daw gets things like displaying video, rx integration, reversing a clip or simple mouse interaction wrong and does not get fixed for allost half a year I must say that it does not meet the most simple quality standards I can think of as a user.
A company that releases such useless versions is not a company I trust with the most important software in my business. That is the reason I will finish my projects for amazon prime and zdf and switch to another option. It‘s a matter of missing trust of Steinberg‘s understanding of my business.
If I were in your shoes, and really couldn’t get any work done in Nuendo, then I would switch DAW too.
It must be that we are different.
In all honestly, I have always worked with the tools that served me best. Until now that was CoolEdit pro and Nuendo.
RX … I have much bigger issues with Izotope than a not properly working RX Connect.
Izotopes code is so bad that it even breaks projects upon reopening, issues which haven’t been resolved for years now.
But apparently that isn’t as important than things that are hyped.
For the record, I could make RX connect work. Granted with some specific precautions, but I made it work.
I have one freelancer who had a BIG problem with N8 and RX connect, so we just fired up N7. No big deal.
Nothing more than just clicking another icon on the toolbar.
Yes, I am biased and not objective, but I do am realistic.
If PT or any other DAW could make me more money tomorrow, I would switch in a heartbeat.
And it’s different for each and everyone.
I can only tell youi my side of the story. Which is the story of a happy user.
And for the record … None of our 6 Nuendo systems is sponsered by Steinberg, none of our Nuage systems is sponsered by Yamaha.
They were all paid for.
I guess from your point of view we’re just whining for no reason. The thing is, everybody has a different point of view. There are many workflows, many systems, many ways to get work done. Some people choose one way of working, others have a different way of working. Both are legitimate. It’s great Nuendo really works for you and you’re really close to Steinberg. I guess that’s why you also get annoyed by our posts. You have a view into Steinberg, what’s going on behind the scenes. And it’s a great personal treat if you don’t get beaten down by crashes, slow UI, and you can just look over these things. And I really mean it! If you can, you can concentrate a lot more on getting work done!
I’m somebody who needs a very clear way of working. I clean my table and I have a very structured work environment. And I’m really hindered and annoyed by crashes, slow UI response, and all the workarounds I have to keep in mind to work in a way Nuendo is actually supposed to work. I’m sure there’s a workaround for everything. If automation crashes, don’t use automation. Use clip gain. Create a bus for every track when automation on the bus doesn’t crash. If VCA’s don’t work, don’t use them. VCA’s were not present in older versions and we could get our work done all the same. All true. But many don’t have a personality as you and are genuinely annoyed by the sum of itches, to the point where they cannot get their work done. At least me, when I constantly run into problems where I have to find workarounds, I get angry. One thing doesn’t bother me. 10 things do. Especially when it’s supposed to work “as advertised”.
When I buy a car where I first have to open the rear left door to open the trunk, there’s something wrong with the car. If I have to use a third party gearbox because the built-in gearbox stutters and makes the car randomly turn down the engine on the highway, I’d be really angry. Sure you can get from point A to be in this car. But who’d willingly buy such a car? Some people love a car with an “attitude”. I don’t.
It IS a big deal because we all paid for it. I want to use the new functions of N8, that I paid for, why else buy N8 in the first place? But those new features don’t work in N7. So how can I just fire up 7? I use one Nuendo, not 20 versions, 1 version for each track because DOP works OK in 8, video in 7, and the UI was more responsive in 6. I have no plans to start taking notes which projects and parts of projects I have to open in which version because other stuff is broken. When your car breaks down on your way to an important client meeting, 100km in and 100km to go, no big deal? You just get your 6 year old second car out of the garage and ride on? Well, it only cost €40’000, so why complaining. You’ll get to your destination with one of your 3 cars in the garage.
Basically you’re saying one out of two things above;
Either I don’t know how to get the job done with the tools at my disposal,
Or I do know how to do it, but shouldn’t complain, because it can be done.
Those are the two options. You already know that I can get work done in Nuendo, so your question is rhetorical and disingenuous. You seem to just not like that some of us have a problem with how Steinberg conducts its business relative to us users.
I’ve done far more work in PT these past two years after a peak on Nuendo about three years ago. I have been able to take work that otherwise would have priced some people out of the studios I work in by doing that at home. This includes everything from Tourism commercials to ESPN / Mastercard commercials to shows on MTV. But not recently.
So my question was simply what my incentive is to give Steinberg more money.
You want to argue about facility use then go ahead. I worked on Superbowl 50 for example, and CBS had how many Nuendo stations? I’m currently working on NHL content, how many Nuendo stations in the facility? Zero. Last time I encountered a Nuendo setup in the US was a remote source connect VO where the talent was deep in New Jersey or somewhere. It’s just not widely used here.
So if the point is that people can use Nuendo (because you can) then that argument falls completely flat in New York the second I tell them how VCAs looked on release, and then proceed to tell them about Steinberg reps being pricks on a public forum (gearslutz) as well as then not fixing it for over a year. They’d laugh in my face if I proposed switching to Nuendo, or even using.
ADR functionality. Great. Now can I trim ADR tracks when doing the ADR predub using VCAs? No? Ok…
Well, let me respond in exactly the same way you come off: If you can’t do ANY work in RX then you should use something else. Personally I don’t have those problems with RX, I have problems with RX in Nuendo.
And that is actually true. Zero “broken projects” upon reopening.
It’s a bit hard to take you seriously when you on the one hand tell us indirectly that the app is good enough to do work in, and that any problems we have are with personal setups or with hyped features, then go ahead and complain about RX breaking projects.
It’s ‘some’ deal if you paid for a product and it doesn’t work. Not a big deal to you, but a big deal to other people.
And this is why I haven’t paid for N8. So you didn’t have to tell me that. As a matter of fact, I’m pretty sure I said exactly that in this thread (though I’m not going to check).
As I have stated I do get work done in N7 and have survived in the business for 20+ years.
No need to fire your guns at iZotope either.
THEY did not break connect
THEY came up with a software that has become industry standard in a heartbeat and that no audio post studio lives without.
THEY have happy users who embrace new innovative software that works very well for me.
Speaking of noise reduction. Have you heard the new NR in Wavelab, a Steinberg product. It‘s not even close to the old Sonnox solution that was included before. I am talking about what I perceive as a problem of Steinbergs decrasing product quality that I get tired of witnessing.
You say we must be different. Well yes, we must be. While you try to defend bug ridden releases, I get annoyed by bad software. It is the reason I once chose Nuendo.
And a very helpful and well respected one at that.
I for one am not interested in a roadmap from Steinberg. What should we do with a roadmap that said “VCA functionality” or “New Lower Zone Window Layout”, or “Direct Offline Processing” or “Profile Manager to manage multiple user profiles”. All of them sound wonderful on paper. Many of them didn’t work or somehow work but were half-heartedly implemented. I’m not interested in a roadmap but more in a dialog with Steinberg so we could work together in fixing outstanding issues that plague users. This should get us the studio environment we paid for and make the experience better for everybody in the process.
“I’m sure there’s a workaround for everything. If automation crashes, don’t use automation. Use clip gain. Create a bus for every track when automation on the bus doesn’t crash. If VCA’s don’t work, don’t use them. VCA’s were not present in older versions and we could get our work done all the same. All true. But many don’t have a personality as you and are genuinely annoyed by the sum of itches, to the point where they cannot get their work done. At least me, when I constantly run into problems where I have to find workarounds, I get angry. One thing doesn’t bother me. 10 things do. Especially when it’s supposed to work “as advertised”.”
The N8 can not use for any serious work. N7 also has a lot of bugs, but N8 is really terrible.
It has never been so bad, over the past 18 years.
Fredo man, I love you, and your support for SB and its product is admirable.
I don’t doubt you have a solution that works for you.
Here is my situation: switched to the an iMac 5k 2 years ago as I couldn’t stand Windows any longer. N7 performed fairly well, though it did struggle on bigger sessions; SB had been aware already for some time that GUI lag was becoming a serious issue on the Mac (other Daw’s, like Logic or even Studio One didn’t appear to struggle to get a good responsive UI going)
N8 got released; liked the functionality, but totally unusable on the Mac. GUI lag to such a degree that even clicking and selecting things can take seconds. Sometimes the tool switching is so slow, it causes a crash because it hasn’t switched tools whilst you’re already clicking something else (poof!)
Checked various forums, seems I’m certainly not the only one.
Got my first major feature film to score - realised the Mac version would bot be able to handle my +500 track template.
Had a PC specialist build me a £2000 Sky-lake PC so i could quickly switch back.
N8 still not usable enough, even with the 8.1 update.
Back on N7 which for the most part is flying on the new PC; but still can’t use N8 on my projects.
Yeah, that pisses me off.
So, now I’m in a rock and a hard place; Nuendo on the Mac is generally a joy to use; it seems more stable, and we don’t have the annoying issue of disappearing plug-ins or 64 unique plug-in limit that Windows has (I’d completely forgotten about it until I loaded a session…ah, there are the bugs I remember!)
But, the Mac version is just too laggy to be useable.
On the PC, N7 works, N8 doesn’t for me. And we have the mssing plug-in issue back again…seems I’m fracked whatever I do
And, to drag up an old issue again - I’m still baffled as to why a Nuendo license can’t run Cubase either. Hell, I’d be happy to even pay for Cubase updates if that’s what takes - SB could even consider offering a rebate/price difference for the Nuendo update if people have bought the Cubase update first).
It frustrates me no end that every year we get to look at Cubase features for 4-6 months before we get to use them…is SB really that concerned they’re loosing out on potential Cubase users, considering these people would likely never splash out on a new license anyway as they already have the flagship product?