ISSUE - Render in Place Nuendo

Nuendo
1

Hey Everyone,

I’m on the latest build (6 Mar) of Nuendo 8, I’m PC based (Win 10, 64bit)

I don’t know if this is a real issue, but when I Render in Place two mono tracks, routed to a mono group, it renders me a stereo track and file.

I know this was an issue back in 2015 with cubase. Wasn’t it solved for Nuendo too?

Any thoughts?

Thanks in advance!

2

For me, also on PC and the latest N8 build, rendering in place a mono track to a mono bus produces a mono track. That’s to a Bus as I almost never use mono Groups.

Is it a Group vs Bus issue? Is your mono Group assigned to a stereo out? I mix through an external mixer so that makes for both mono and stereo Busses. Seems maybe the final output Bus determines mono/stereo.

3

Havent used Render in Place for a while, but as I remember it, its the Output Channel that defines what sort of track is rendered. Only if you route your mono group to a mono out, a mono track will be rendered.

Oswald

4

… and it also depends on which render option you choose in the Render settings dialogue (Channel Settings, Complete Signal path or other option).

5

Hey everyone, thanks for the feedback, you guys rock.

The thing is, when I use Render in Place on a mono track that’s routed to a mono group (and that mono group is routed to my stereo out) I get a beautiful mono track.

If I select two audio clips from diferent tracks, both mono and adressed to the same mono group, two things happen:

  1. I’m unable to choose “Mixdown to one Audio file” if select the “Dry” option of Render in Place

  2. I can only check the “Mixdown to one Audio file” box if I choose “Channel Settings”, “Complete Signal Path” or “Complete Signal Path + MasterFx”. Using the Channel Settings option, I always get a stereo file, no matter what.

Unread post by Oswald Schwander » 02 Apr 2018 14:13

Havent used Render in Place for a while, but as I remember it, its the Output Channel that defines what sort of track is rendered. Only if you route your mono group to a mono out, a mono track will be rendered.

I’ve tried routing the two mono tracks to a BUS (FX Track) that was routed to the MonoOut. Indeed it worked, and my problem was “solved”.

I’m lingering on the fact that this is a workaround and not that practical. I always work with my StereoOut on my workflow, and I think it would be great to have the possibility to create a mono file from two mono sources.

Do you guys know any other workflow for this? Or am I going to have to always route my channels to a Mono Out?

Thanks for the support! :ugeek: :ugeek: :ugeek:

6

AFAIK there’s no way to do this with RIP. Perhaps try Export Audio Mixdown instead… select the Group Channel and check ‘Mono Downmix’.

7

FX channels and Group channels seem to me to be essentially identical, and it seems to me they should function the same way when it comes to RIP. Seems like a bug to me (or “less than optimal design”).

Also, I don’t think we call FX channels “buses” in Steinberg’s world, do we? A “bus” sums signals, and that’s what both groups and fx channels have to do to function (as well as outputs). In Pro Tools buses are separate from auxes and outputs so it makes sense to use the term there.

8

Once again, thanks guys for the input.

Yeah, I tought this was missing from RIP functionality. Hope Steinberg’s team can pick this thread up and try to include this option on next releases!

9

They do function the same way. And I’m not really sure how FX channels are directly relevant to the use of RIP.

I don’t really understand what the OP means precisely by routing a signal to an FX bus :confused: . Please clarify.

When using RIP (with Channel settings or Complete signal Path checked)

  • a signal routed to an FX channel which is routed to a mono bus gives you a mono result And the same for a Group channel routed to a mono bus.
  • a signal routed to an FX channel routed to a stereo bus gives you a stereo result. And the same for a Group channel routed to a stereo bus.

Yes because the destination was a mono bus. But what do you mean by BUS (FX Track)? Please clarify. You mean an FX channel?

If you mean an option to somehow mix audio events by selecting ‘Dry’ in the RIP dialogue and then checking the ‘Mix Down to One Audio File’ option, this wouldn’t be possible/practical since, by definition, if you select ‘Dry’ you are not including the levels and output busses. How do you mix the events together? How would you regulate the levels of multiple events? What happens if a user selects five mono events and hopes to mix those into a single mono event? How do you deal with the final level of the audio in the resulting single mono event?

In my opinion, Export Audio Mixdown (select the Group Channel and check ‘Mono Downmix’ as suggested above) is a better and more practical option for this case

10

I’m going to have to go ahead and say that the guys and gals coding Render-in-place do not see things the same way as some of us users. For me, the function of rendering in that setting is to effectively freeze plugins and edits on a channel. Lots of reasons for doing this and one of my main reasons is to freeze audio from a drum trigger for further editing, post replacement.

So all I’m looking for from Render-in-place in that common instance is to give me a printed version with identical attributes as the original track right where I was with zero hassle to continue working. Seeing as how I’m working with external processing and mixing involved, lots of things and especially drums are going to be on a mono output

So if you do not work entirely in the Box there’s a very strong chance you’re going to have at least a few mono outputs, or in my case 64 of them along with 32 stereo. The creators of the current iteration of Render-n-place must not have foreseen this need…

Steinberg, can we please slate this for improvement and future updates?

11

Agree with you on that. (But not the OP’s original issue - two mono events mixed down to a single mono event). I’m sure a better way of managing mono attributes in the context you describe here would be most welcome.

12

BUS = FX Channel. I know it’s not a BUS but was to demonstrate my POV.

When using RIP (with Channel settings or Complete signal Path checked)

  • a signal routed to an FX channel which is routed to a > mono > bus gives you a > mono > result And the same for a Group channel routed to a > mono > bus.
  • a signal routed to an FX channel routed to a > stereo > bus gives you a > stereo > result. And the same for a Group channel routed to a > stereo > bus.

Like I said, if I RIP (Dry) one mono track routed to a mono group or FX Channel(routed to my stereo out) I indeed get a mono file.

If I do this with two mono tracks (Channel Setttings), adressed to same groups I get a stereo file. That’s the diference.




If you mean an option to somehow mix audio events by selecting ‘Dry’ in the RIP dialogue and then checking the ‘Mix Down to One Audio File’ option, this wouldn’t be possible/practical since, by definition, if you select ‘Dry’ you are not including the levels and output busses. How do you mix the events together? How would you regulate the levels of multiple events? What happens if a user selects five mono events and hopes to mix those into a single mono event? How do you deal with the final level of the audio in the resulting single mono event?

In my opinion, Export Audio Mixdown (select the Group Channel and check ‘Mono Downmix’ as suggested above) is a better and more practical option for this case

Yeah, this makes sense. Maybe I am sucessfull with the one track mono export because of the Dry Option. When summing two mono tracks I indeed need the channel settings, but I would be happier in my work flow if I could get an imediate mono file instead of a stereo one, without having to rout my tracks to Mono Out.

13

To sum this up, seems like you need a ‘Mono Downmix’ option in the RIP dilaogue (or at least this might help your particular case). How about making a feature request for this?

14

Yap, that’s what I’ll do =) Thanks for the input!