[ISSUE] VCA kills Trim-Modus

I just tried VCAs for the first time, but it appears that when a track is connected to a VCA, you cannot use trim-modus on that track any longer.

Please repro:

  1. Create a audio track and put some audio content onto it.
  2. Connect this track to a VCA-fader
  3. Go into Write and Trim, and just touch the fader of the audio-track.

Here: The audio-content is played back on a much lower volume level immediately.

Since I am in trim-modus most of time, I had to throw out all VCAs just a few minutes after setting them up for the first time. Is this a bug just at my place? Can anybody repro?

Definite bug. There are some issues with VCAs where what you hear while writing is not what is heard on playback so this might be related. I hope this is fixed soon.

The hell???


Please put [ISSUE} in the thread headline so they’re aware of it. This is very annoying.


  • Trim mode is not necessary on my system.
  • It doesn’t only immediately lower level; in some cases the level gets raised.

As I mentioned in another thread, this is sth which should be discovered in beta-phase after several minutes. I can’t imagine a dialog-mix without using trim-modus. Impossible to get all the tweaks you have to do in one shot. But, btw, Avid’s beta-testing plays in the same league…

I hope this is fixed soon. VCAs are pretty much impossible to use at the moment when you have automation going with the channel and VCA fader. What you hear during write is not what is heard during playback.


As I said before, development ran into a last minute problem with this, and it couldn’t be fixed before release.
Is fixed in the upcoming maintenance update.


I don’t recall seeing any release notes CLEARLY outlining this issue. Was there a warning anywhere?

Glad to hear VCAs are being looked at. Hope SB have got their heads around it now, because at the moment, the whole concept of VCAs within N7 seems messed up. To my way of thinking, the VCA fader should be totally independent of the channel faders it is associated with - moving a VCA fader should not move a channel fader or write any automation into the controlled channel’s automation. Otherwise it defeats half of the point of having VCAs…

In the real world, a VCA doesn’t control the associated channel faders, it controls the gain of a VCA thats in each channel fader’s path. Thats what makes them so useful - you can move the channel fader and the vca fader independently (and automate them independently) and the end result is the sum of the two fader moves…

While were at it, Im not sure a VCA channel send control should be able to control the sends on the associated channels. That sounds like a recipe for utter confusion. I can’t think of any practical application for it… If you want to globally automate the send level for a number of channels, you can always route that send to a group first, making it a master fader for the send… (and then its also a whole lot easier to see whats going on).

Is it just me or did this just get worse!!:!?!?!??!?


1. Create Audio Track.

2. Set (global) automation to “Touch”, and write simple automation. Write from zero to say -20dBFS, hold a little, then release.

3. Set automation to “Touch” AND “Trim”, and write again. This time write trim from zero (no boost/cut) to minus infinity.

At this point all should work as expected. If you deselect “Trim” the curve should be shown “post-trim”. You can toggle back and forth between “undo” and “redo” to see that it makes logical sense.
4. Select “undo” to undo the last trim pass. Select “Touch” and “Trim” again.
5. Create VCA track. Select the Audio track as source.
6. Write automation to the audio track as in step #3.

Watch the level JUMP to maximum even though you went from zero gain to minus infinity!


please download the new 7.0.30 maintenance update. The issue should be fixed with this update.


I got the impression that Lydiot had installed the N7.0.30 update but that it did not solve the problem.

Are you now referring to a new version of N7.0.30 ?

I downloaded 7.0.30 the day it appeared and tested this recently. So either we’re talking about the same version or there has been a change to the same version I downloaded.

Did you test the issue yourself?

I’m not able to test it at present.

Not sure what Timo means by ‘new 7.0.30 maintenance update’. Would that be the original update or an update of the update?


I just tested this with a new project, and the results of my last post still stands - HOWEVER - I’ve now had one instance where the automation moves downwards instead of upwards.

Have you guys tested the above? It still does the same on Nuendo v.7.0.35 build 585 (Nov 24 2015)

You guys at Steinberg have got to be kidding me, right???

PLEASE tell me I’m missing something!

I confirm this problem. Plus another one: When opening project, some VCA-grouped channels are all at level -infinite. This happens randomly. Most of the times I reopen the project everything is ok.

Just in case anyone at Steinberg reads this: We end up with a fader at maximum level. Max. Suppose someone is ignorant enough (i.e. uninformed of this bug) and does this to a music track in a post project, which are often mixed to peak at 0dBFS (for commercials etc). You now get peaks at +12dBFS blasting through your speakers!!!


Do we have to campaign yet again to get this done or?

I guessed we wouldn’t see this fixed before v7.5, and I guess I’m right about that (unless I’m still missing something with regards to testing it). So v7.5 comes out, we wait for fixes for all the bugs in that version, and then Steinberg releases other stuff we don’t need, and then spends another month or two before thy fix this… so… what? June? July? Ever?

After having taken the time to try to fix this I just simply can’t grasp the fact that it’s still broken.

I’m with you… But too tired to nagging on aboutthings that Steinberg should fix ASAP (as in all men to the pumps).

This is actually close to a scandal (both in Cubase and Nuendo), and it is almost impossible to mix with confidence when you don’t know how the app behave. With volume jumps all over, no sounds on track with automation (cubase) etc…

I’ll bet PreSonus’ Studio One will get a working VCA feature before both Cubase and Nuendo (and also Import Session Data - as they are pulling over a great deal of PT users these days).

Have I/We been loyal too long, hmmm :confused: