Attached is a clean file just with groups. I have wasted my whole day trying to figure this out…and unless I have missed something…there is something seriously wrong
I have a Brauer type bussing setup. Insert Bug.cpr (446.7 KB)
On Row 1;
When I try and insert eg a native cubase plugin, it lets me insert,
but after closing, the inserts no longer respond to click eg edit, bypass etc
It allows insert fine on the master buss and utility but not the A,B,C etc
None of that has been touched…they are native cubase plugs!
This is a simple case of, can anyone open the plugins as per picture…and can you install a plugin to the first row without issue
Its a completely new empty project with those groups imported from a problem project
Not sure I understand you…what does pdc have to do with gui not opening? My question was to ask if someone could open this project, as per the forum guidelines, to see if this problem exists for others. No one has confirmed this? ie ‘Do the plugs have latency’??? or am I missing something
ok…although I read the manual…NOWHERE does it say clearly (that I could see) that enabling PDC/disables the ability to edit plugins affected by pdc
The pdc was not on in the toolbar so I never saw it. I have been using cubase since v1 and was on 5.5 for nearly 10 years and never had to manage pdc/gui relationship.
Wow…a little user feedback on the gui eg tooltip thats ‘plugin disabled by pdc’…or trying to click on it brings up an error. This is incredibly unintuitive
Thanks for the help…
So for any other searching in the future
Activating CONSTRAIN PDC (Plugin delay compensation) will STOP the response of plugins that are deemed ‘affected’ by the settings found in VST/Dealy preferences.
Plugins will load into a slot and if the ‘open gui’ setting is on, the gui will load once for editing. Upon close of the gui, the plugin slot will turn blue for native vst/black for 3rd party and no longer respond to gui interaction until Constrain Delay Compensation’ is turned back off
This setting was not on the toolbars by default and how it got turned on without a mouse click…Im not quite sure.
The function “Constrain delay compensation” turns delay compensation off to perform latency critical tasks without the need to disabel all plugins step by step
And if you hover the button there is an <!> to show that this will do something important…
Well thats how I read that…toolbar icon was hidden by default…had no idea. How can you hover over something that is not exposed on the toolbar by default.
The centre focus is the outcome…the disable plugins…thats where the user feedback endpoint should be. Good Ux design always begins at the user endpoint and works backwards
I would never use it because most of the recordings I work on are groups ie recorded at once in realtime and pdc is irrelevant. ie Its mostly and acoustic realtime event…all electronic components are also realtime by the performer.
As I wrote in my first reply. This happens with plugins that have some latency when delay compensation is turned on or off or whatever, but the icon is lit
@folkfreak; Yep that was actually the confusion for me…I had not touched it nor was it visible nor was there any feedback to the user. It even let me load an affected plugin and use the gui but then locked me out.
A simple notification directly on an affected plugin would have been great…sorry I didnt respond to you straight up…I can see now how simple it was and wasted many hours thinking it was a plugin issue, reinstalling waves blah blah. As soon as I enabled the icon on the toolbar it all made sense…but as I said, I would never use this because I work mainly with musicians who play together rather than isolated in a bedroom/studio somewhere and there is very little tracking or editing …just mixing…after the first realtime session. Thats how music was made…back in the day…before the days of paint by numbers.
Cheers
Yep sorry, typo…activating ‘constrain’ will STOP…after a day of wasting my time…was pretty tired. I thought you were saying it activated by default…but you meant general PDC is on by default and constrain is a choice…as mentioned…for me, ‘constrain’ was somehow turned on because it was not exposed for me to click’.
Its just bad ux design…sorry very bad. I did an (unifinished) masters in digital media/ux and this is a culture deep blindness which disobeys first precepts.
I just meant the state/feedback loop begins, for any ui element at its granular level. so that in my case, the feedback would have been immediate and knowledge building to the user ie as it works back through the tree/schema of a program
the function was turned on…without my intent or knowledge of it.
PDC (plugin delay compensation) Constraint issues:
For anyone else looking…here is what I experienced and hopefully help you
PROBLEM:
Some plugins seemed to be disabled and unable to edit etc
Some new plugins may be inserted into a slot and edited/reopened but some have the power button disabled and when closed, cannot be reopened
If you have slot selected and use the arrow keys to eg move left or right, the selection skips tracks and jumps over loaded slot without seeming reason
If you land on an affected plugin that was previously on, it will land on the insert but not respond, the arrow keys no longer/respond or move along tracks, however if selects a track with affected plugins that are blue, as soon as the track is selected, the affected plugins mysteriously loose the solid blue fill and are disabled. Manually moving to the next track renables the solid blue fill
All this is caused by 1 option called ‘Constrain Delay Compensation’.
It can be found, depending on setup either in the project/top tool bar OR trahsport tool bar or its empirical choice is found on functions menu on mix console toolbar, that is IF its enable to be shown on the window layout options
SOLUTION
hehe…turned it off
Would be nice if it had reasonable user feedback eg affected plugins could display the relevant icon with a tool tip
Affected by what?
And why the hair brain skipping of slots but able to load an affected plugin??
And some still turn blue if you scroll to the adjacent track to it…what is that madness?
This is what is meant by ‘culture deep’: easy to be blinded by gradual acclimatisation to products
Colours and iconography are ways to refine the ui especially for ‘new’ users.
Its just vague abstract communication in a professional product. Simple fix…anyway i spent the time to outline and hopefully help others.
Im programming Live matrix controllers atm…colour is king in modal communications.
This is why sophisticated UI is costly I guess…I also program and use programs like Archicad and Inventor; Archicad has been developed and refined to be an incredibly nice tool…with consistent and clear endpoint communication. Inventor, even though a powerful tool, has all the weird and hidden quirks that are costly to learn; similiar but not as bad as Cubase…its come a long way since pro24 hehe
My intent is to improve the product with honest ‘fresh user’ perspective; I love Cubase but doesnt mean it couldnt use some help
They have a latency value smaller than the threshold of the constrain delay compensation .
Maybe you should read the manual on this topic again
The button is hidden by default… why should a new user bring it to the toolbar?
And why should a new user click on a menu item without the understanding what it does?
no not really,
it gets ignored by people like you, clicking everything without the understanding of the background…
We had some more discussions on this topic…
and all people with this problem had in common that they tried to turn on delay compensation, but totally missed the word “constrain” and none of them was aware of the button… and of course all ignored the fact that delay compensation is always on by default.
BUT if the plugin is known to be above threshold…then why not give a notice when choosing it?
But thats what Im saying here…sure its my fault, sure Im well acquainted with latency vs realtime playing when I use to use a lot of midi but I just learn to play the real instruments…but I do not recall touching it and I dont touch stuff without manual ref/youtubing it at each step
Of course all the things make sense in what you are saying but ‘cultural blindness’ is really the point here and making programs as elegant and communicative…for little effort…is not a bad thing.
I apologised for inverting ‘constrain’ in my tiredness but to my knowledge…the constraint was turned on without intent…which is the whole point of my response…communicated well at the endpoint is key ux design, it would not have been an issue for anyone and its these details that make eg Apple a better interface (Im a pc user btw but I appreciate the ux detail)
Anyway, thanks for putting up with me…Im not sure you are seeing my perspective here but that is fine…Im just trying to help Cubase become better with fresh user experiences.
