Hi,
for registration switching in my YAMAHA Genos Keyboard, I would need the function to send sysex data in VST Live. Can you foresee approximately when this will come in VST Live pro. I think many Yamaha device owners are waiting for this function.
Greetings
Herbert
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You can record and play back Sysex in VST Live. What are you missing?
Hi @musicullum
I have tried to record SYSEX data. Unfortunately, I did not manage to record anything. At least I could not see any data in the “recorded” midi track.
Quite the opposite. My whole midi setup was shaken and I had to restart VST Live including my studio computer and Motu express XT several times. It seemed like the midi memory was overflowing even when VST Live was stopped. At times the VST load indicator showed more than 90%.
Apart from that, I think (in my case) it is not a good idea to record sysex - data.
Because the Yamaha Genos sends sysex data at a keystroke which I don’t need at all.
The not needed Sysex data I would have to read out again laboriously Manuel and delete, so that only the data remain, which I need. For me unfortunately no no solution.
So far I have used in my stage software for each of my titles, a small dummy Midifile with the Sysex data, which I need for the song call on the Yamaha Genos.
This procedure works very well in the third party software.
An import of these dummy files in VST Live, does not work either. When I import an (imported midi track with sysex data), no switching is done when playing it no sysex data is sent.
In my opinion we need in VST Live a sysex input editor that could look like this.
or a midieditor similar to Cubase is available.
I hope it could be described reasonably understandable.
Herbert
First: next version will feature rudimentary sysex editing:
Second,
There was no display of SysEx data yet. You will see it in the editor as shown in the picture.
But it only sends those data on request, so why send it in the first place?
You will be able to delete those with the new sysex editing feature.
But how do you import this? With a standard MIDI file? If so, could you pls send us a short one, thanks!
We’ll add a preference to filter SysEx MIDI Input, but that will be global for all tracks.
Hi @musicullum
Thank you very much for the quick reply.
I would like to start with your question: “Why do I do this or do I need this”?
I am a solo entertainer and have more than 200 titles in my program.
For each of these titles there is a registration bank on my Yamaha Genos.
In a registration bank all keyboard setting data for the corresponding song are stored. VST Live is supposed to send a short sysex to the Yamaha Genos when a song is selected and thereby make the correct keyboard setting. I hope my way of working becomes a little clearer.
I’m looking forward to the version where you can edit sysex.
Great.
At the moment, unfortunately, this does not work, as I had to find out today.
Tested with version [1.2.2.745]
If i import my short Midifile with Sysex Data, VST Live show this in the Editor.page Tested with version [1.2.2.745]
The original Short Midifile was these, include the two Sysex string.
Und es war Sommer - Peter Maffay - SSL.mid (686 Bytes)
- Sysex called via Path text the Registration Bank on Yamaha Genos.
- Sysex activate Button One from 10 Buttons on Yamaha Genos.
This ist what i need.
If I selected the Registrationbank on Yamaha Genos and record in VST Live I get following in Midi Editor.
.
After recording, VST Live stumbles and messes up my whole setup. Then only a restart helps.
As you can see in the picture, the Yamaha Genos transfers more data than I need.
This is the reason why for me the recording solution is not helpful. For other users maybe it is…
A working sysex import from my short midis would help me a lot.
Thanks for your support.
Greetings Herbert
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No, it is not in there yet. Check the new version coming soon.
Currently, it should not even attempt to show sysex data.
Will check your midifile, thanks!
Thanks for the midi file. There is a bug with the time display in the Midi List Editor.
Also, with the changes we made for the upcoming version, the sysex string is displayed as intented, and it can then be edited or removed.
This sounds very good and will make all Yamaha device owners very happy.
Many parameters of these devices are set via Sysex.
Thank you very much.
Hi Herbert,
Do you mind me asking did you manage to switch Genos registrations using VST Live?
I tried it and it worked but have to press Play twice, that is:
- Press Play
- Press Stop twice to stop and start again at the beginning
- Press Play again
Then the registration is selected on the Genos. But this is very inconvenient to do and the inaccuracy seems to be coming from VST Live. Perhaps there is a chance for improvement.
Any comments on this?
Thank you…
Hi @InitialGain,
we’ve identified a problem with the Stop Button. The MIDI Playback Engine will loose some MIDI events if the Stop Button was pressed too much. We’ve fixed it and it was added to the next Pre-Release (Friday). Could you please check your workflow with the next Pre-Release (2.0.13)?
See you,
Michael.
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Hi Michael,
Many thanks for your reply and workflow.
I would like to mention if you don’t mind, is there a chance to include a SysEx Send without having to Play and Stop the prepared midi file but every time when selecting another song?
This would be very convenient to select registrations on my Genos by sending the SysEx data.
I tried this on Cakewalk by BandLab and it has a Send button that when pressed it sends the SysEx data and a registration was selected on my Genos without having to press the Play and Stop buttons.
But what I would like to see in VST Live is, an option I could select, to send the SysEx data each time I select a song on VST Live, together with of course, an editing window so I could edit the SysEx data for the songs (registrations) I have on my Genos.
I’m sure that would be a great feature and beneficial not only for me but for many.
Thank you for your consideration and help…
Good point, will be added to the next version.
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Hello InitialGain.
Sorry for the late reply. I was on vacation and couldn’t respond immediately.
I tested it again for you yesterday before I share my final result with you.
I can say that my test registration was switched from VST Live, but rather randomly. It doesn’t work, and only if I connect my YAMAHA GENOS2 directly to my computer via USB.
Actually, I’ve been using a MOTU Express XT for my midi devices for years. But I can’t use it for VST Live in connection with sysex commands.
VST-Live destroys the complete MOTU midi driver for me. Without a computer restart, nothing works anymore. I would rule out a defect in my Motu, because I have been using the device for over 10 years with all Cubase versions (now Cubase 13) and there has never been a failure in this direction.
Summary:
I think VST-Live pro is a great idea and have been following the project from the beginning.
That’s why I bought it. I even made the leap to version 2.0. But my hopes for the program have not been fulfilled.
For my part, I will not invest any more time in VST Live and will not use it anymore. I chose the software from another company that is better suited for my purposes.
Greeting Herbert
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Hello @Herbert_Schmitt,
Let me dive into this thread, too.
I am really sorry to hear that. But you need to give us more details how VST Live can trouble your device that only a restart helps? Let me first grab all points here
… this point is solved.
… that’s solved. You can edit SysEx Data in the MIDI List editor and the MIDI editor.
… the MIDI Editor has now a SysEx Editor View. And the Clip-Image in shows info about it, too.
… that’s solved, too.
… have you tried with the latest version 2.0.13? I cannot reproduce any problems with SysEx data recording in VST Live.
Therefore : Can I ask you to record your output into Cubase? Export it as a MIDI File and give it to me? I would like to import the MIDI file to Cubase and send that one to VST Live. Because I dont have access to Yamaha Genos and so I would like to see what is going wrong.
… that was added.
… that’s all added.
Again : Sorry. We are doing our best to get everything solved. And if features are missing, we are trying to get them implemented fast.
See you,
Michael.
@Spork
@musicullum
@InitialGain
Hello Spork,
Thank you for your detailed list of all the actions you and musikullum have implemented in VST live pro. Some of them are mine, others were suggested by @InitialGain and have nothing to do with my sysex problem. I will write something about this below.
I would like to compliment you both on working so hard to make VST Live Pro a success. I have never experienced anything like this from any manufacturer before. You have my greatest respect for that.
Now to my problem with MOTU Midi Express XT.
Before I wrote these lines, I naturally tried to do everything I could to rule out a fault on my part. I am one of those people who, before complaining about things, first check myself to see if there is a fault on my part. In the present case, I rule out any personal fault. But nobody is infallible.
I have attached a small test project that I am making available to you. The good news is that all entered SysExe commands are transferred from VST Live pro 2.0.14 and my connected Yamaha GENOS2 also sets them.
VSTLive-MOTU-Express-XT_SysexTest.vlprj (34.9 KB)
The bad news is that VSTL pro does something to my MOTU Express XT driver that causes no problems at all when running with CUBASE 13.
I have the following illustration.
Here again a little larger
Don’t be confused by the many connections.
I have also tested with just one connection. It is always the same behavior.
With VSTL pro there are problems and in Cubase or all other programs that I also use such as
Studio One 6.5
WaveLab 11
Spectral Layers 10
Midiland Optimizer 12
PC-Live Player 7 etc. not.
After the first start of VSTL pro and the first SysEx transfer, the Motu Express window looks like this.
The graphical display is destroyed and VSTL pro only works shakily.
All my user preset names have been removed.
It is noticeable here that in my Motu Express XT the data activity display “Computer I/O” ( center) signals a data flow for a remarkably long time (almost 25 sec. long), although only two short Syssex commands are sent in VSTL pro. See video. (Unfortunately the *.gif is upside down after resizing. Sorry for that)
I have been communicating all this to you since version 1.1x.x.
I have of course also looked around MOTU for a new driver. Unfortunately, there is no newer driver.
If I want to continue using VSTL pro stably, I have to switch off the MOTU Express XT, shut down the computer and start everything again.
Note: Off topic!
As a solo entertainer, I would need a function that allows a certain preset, for example. Sysex or MSB/LSB, to send CC data to devices before the selected song is started via the Start button.
Something like “before Load”.
Setting condition:
If the user selects a song from the playlist and the selection cursor remains on the list entry for longer than “20 ms”, the preloading of, for example. Sysex or MSB/LSB, CC data is triggered (value determined by the programmer).
If someone does not need such a function, it should be possible to switch it on/off via the “Menu options”.
Bennefit:
This would allow you to check your connected devices before the song starts to ensure that all devices have the correct settings for the song.
In my case, whether the correct registration has been loaded on the Yamaha Genos.
For guitarists, whether the correct start sound is set on the pedalboard. Etc.
Or does this already exist in VSTLive pro and I have missed it?
It should also be mentioned that I work on Windows 10 and my stage computer is not connected to the network, but I still update the latest Windows 10 updates.
Thank you very much for your effort to help me.
Greetings Herbert
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This looks very much like a MIDI loop. Received data are beeing sent again, received again, sent again and so forth.
We can only repeat that System MIDI is abstract. VST Live, just as much as any other app, sends data to a system device the only thing it knows about is its name, and that it claims to be able to receive and/or transmit data in the MIDI Standard format.
We know the MOTU devices and never had any problems with it. As you say, VST Live also becomes shaky which is a very strong indication that it is overloaded because of continuous re-looping MIDI data. Been there 
Both of the projects you sent don’t contain MIDI, you would have to “Save Archive” and send the whole thing as a zip file, then we can at least examine the SysEx data.
When you set preferences “Chase Events on Start” to OFF, it should do that.
So I spent the whole Sunday last week testing my MOTU midi XT with VST Live.
I created a test project in CUBASE 13 with a midi track channel 10.
In this track 4 SYSEX entries were inserted.
The first SYSEX $ Bar position: “1.1.1.0” refers to a registration file on my YAMAHA GENOS 2 and loads it into the Yamaha Genos 2 memory.
The second SYSEX $ F0 43 73 01 52 25 11 00 02 00 00 F7 , bar position: “1.2.1.0”, switches the registration button #1 from blue (deactivated) to red. (activated)
I then inserted the third and fourth entries from bar 4 onwards in the same pattern inserted.
I switched on the loop function and ran it about 100 times.
The MOTU midi expres XT switches all the registrations I want on the Yamaha Genos 2. Just as it should be.
Then I exported the project from Cubase 13 as a VST Live project and imported it into VST Live Ver. 2.0.14.
As soon as I press the Start button in VSL and the first sysex command is read, my MOTU freaks out as described above.
I even unplugged all midi connections on my keyboard to avoid getting a midi loop from the keyboard.
My conclusion:
VST Live does something different than Cubase 13 when dealing with sysex strings.
I can’t explain the behavior any other way.
I give up. 
Greetings
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… can we please have project? Use the “Menu / File / Save Archive …” function to export the project to an empty folder. Then zip it and drop it here or send me PM message.
Thank you,
Michael.
Hello Michael.
I would be very happy to give you the project files.
I hope you find something so that I don’t look like an idiot.
Enclosed is a zip file containing the Cubase 13 project and the Cubase export, as well as the VST Live Archive. If something is missing, just let me know.
I have already tested it with version. 2.0.15. Same problem.
I can’t test the “preloading” of device specific prg changes and other controllers when switching from one song to the next, because of the problems with my MOTU Midi Express XT, as described before.
Thank you again for your exemplary efforts to make everything right for us customers.
Greetings Herbert
2024-06-09_MOTU-SYSEX_Testprojekt.zip (50.6 KB)
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