then we will have to agree to disagree, I think that intentional gatekeeping might be the downfall of dolby, thats my opinion, its not only hard and expensive to start working in atmos, it is also hard to consume dolby content, with everything encoded, only special equipment, etc etc. I already figured out how I will do my atmos work and referencing, with a low budget, and I can guarantee that I will make amazing mixes just like the 50k to 100k studios, they can try but eventually the budget crown will catch on.
Whats wrong with the Dolby binaural app? I haven’t used it because its not relevant to what we do but its available on Windows, Mac/iPhone/iPad, and Android so basically any device can listen to Atmos audio in binaural at the consumer stage through pretty much any headphone port.
Yes but how do you explain that to a person who is not at all computer savvy. It took me over an hour to find it/download/set-up on my surface pro and as there is no real test tracks how do i know it is even properly decoding?. The tracks on the Atmos website weren’t very impressive. Yes i sampled rocket man… Was it right?
I think another question that comes into play here, is from a consumer perspective, surround sound for music never took off because very few people have the speaker setup. Besides soundbars / beaming technology trying to replicate Atmos, I’m just not sure why this wouldn’t fall flat the same way?
On a separate note, are you also creating different mixes for ADM and BIN files considering the difference in True Peak/LUFS between the two, working with the center speaker / LFE, etc.? Just curious since I’ve only worked in Atmos via Sound Design thus far.
I’m starting out in Atmos ( I have a new physical 7.1.4 studio — Apollo X16 and 12 Focal monitors) and have a question for you (I asked it on another thread as well), who have gained experience now : when mixing, do you prefer to do the mix in surround (7.1.4 or 9.1.4, whatever) and then, from a certain point in the work, go to Atmos and continue that way? Or do you start any mix intended for Atmos immediately in Atmos?
Thanks in advance.
I create a stereo master for my clients and the adm. Theyre usually done around the same time but billed as 2 distinct services
I get a stereo mix done. Then, depending on a number of factors, I will either stem the tracks in a way that works well for Atmos (I never use the stereo version reverb/delay) or I save an alternate version of the stereo mix and turn it into an Atmos project.
When I begin the Atmos mix, I work almost entirely in 7.1.4 and just use headphones periodically to ensure its translating well in binaural. If something isn’t working as expected in the downmix, I make the appropriate changes and continue on in 7.1.4. For a little over a year now I’ve been using the native renderer and just trying to skate by without anyone asking for a QC MP4 version lol, but now I’ve got the external renderer if I can ever get the damn thing configured correctly.
Okay, I get it, stereo first, Atmos second. I think this is justified for music. I forgot to say that my projects are Atmos podcasts, with narration (or dialogues), music, sound effects, FX. The contents are stories told, fictions. We are like in the cinema without the images. Stereo, in this case, is not enough. But maybe this is the right way, in this case too, to start a project solidly, a comprehensible and modifiable base. I wonder.
Surround never took off for music because
- It requires artists/labels to release a different version of every song for every speaker configuration.
- The auto-industry stuck with stereo audio systems.
Problem #1 doesnt apply to Atmos Music because it offers a single file that conforms to any system. Stereo, binaural, quad, 5.1, 7.1, 7 1.2, 7.1.4, 9.1 6… all in just 1 file. Thats not as relevant anymore regardless because, thanks to streaming taking over, its no longer the burden of the consumer to purchase the music in any configuration. That now falls on the streaming companies to adopt it, and Dolby is working to make it easy on them.
The second reason also appears to be on its way out. The 2023 Mercedes Maybach featuring a 7.1.4 Dolby Atmos infotainment system sets a new bar for luxury-car sound systems. Rolls Royce will have to follow suit next year, then the S580 and S550 will have the option. Then BMW and Cadillac will have to add the option to stay competitive and, once that happens, 7.1.4 “Premium Sound” Atmos systems will become available options for Buick, Chevy, etc. That’s how it usually goes with new car features. A little over a decade ago, the BMW 7-series had a push-to-start ignition. Today, every car built is made with a push-to-start.
Last year, a rumor began that JBL was developing an aftermarket 7.1.4 car audio system that will stream Apple Music+/Amazon-Music/Tidal in 7.1.4 Im sure that would require creative speaker installation, so it still wont be cheap, but I know a lot of people who spend a lot of money on sound systems in their cars, so there’s definitely a market for it. If they’re smart, they’ll utilize the fact that Atmos isn’t channel-based and make it extremely customizable to work with factory Premium Sound packages. The speaker layout in my Cadillac has speakers up high that would do fine for top speakers. It also has L,C,R, LFE, and something like 3 more stereo pairs. If it were fed by an Atmos receiver it would be 9.1 4… so an aftermarket automobile Atmos sound system could work fine in plenty of cars already
Wow. 7.1.4 in a car. Hard to believe. Sounds to me like an overkill. Is perhaps good enough for show-off.
It is already difficult to get 5.1 playing well in a car, For one person, there is perhaps something like a sweet-spot. All other people in the car will hear with incorrect balance. With 7.1.4, that gets even worse.
LG, Juergen
I agree and disagree with you on the sweet spot. In the studio, you definitely need to be in an exact position. Its an irrefutable fact. However from a consumer standpoint, I often find myself intentionally moving around and turning because you get a unique experience. Saying you can’t enjoy 7.1.4 unless you’re positioned in the center of an atmos rig is like saying you can’t enjoy a concert from the stage.
Sure, some songs/mixes will be better than others but that’s always the case anyway. In fact, even just listening to stereo music in the car, you already can have a better or worse experience depending on the car and where you’re sitting because of the subwoofer, speaker choices, and acoustics of the vehicle. Im actually excitedly waiting for the chance to have 7.1.4 in my car.
There are ways when you are mixing to widen the sweet spot - but there will always be a sweet spot… It is why I am excited to play with Atmos binaural - wear the sweet spot
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It’s an interesting discussion that’s for sure! Just sharing another perspective here from someone who’s been in the business for 50 years. RE: Atmos music: Elliot Scheiner - Elliot Scheiner on Dolby Atmos - YouTube
I rode the curl of the wave in Dolby Stereo Film circa 1972. There was a lot of nay sayers like, Elliot. A lot of mixers in Hollywood who just wanted Dolby to go away.
Then along came Star Wars. A lot of studios, mixers, theaters had to decide if they were on the bus or off the bus. The rest is history…
I think the real problem is not that music wouldn’t sound great in 3D if done right, but that Atmos is a proprietary format.
Dietz I don’t understand what you mean by that, Please explain.
I don’t know why it didn’t occur to me sooner. Its been quite awhile since I first posted this. We’re now a fully functioning 7.1.4 Dolby Atmos studio with an incredible PMC monitor rig and even a 512x512 channel Dante interface with enough outputs to run Atmos and analog processing at the same time…
I can supply Dolby Atmos Music on MP4. They play just fine on my phone and the 7.1.4 system at home that I use for quality control before mastering final versions for release.
If anyone is looking for music on MP4, I’m sure I can pick out a couple good ones. For free obviously because I don’t own the right to sell copies of any of it
Oh yes please I would be most appreciative of that!
You could audio watermark it or just do partial versions for safety.