Why do Audio Mixdown .wav files sound completely different then Cubase stereo outs?

[somecomposer]

Hans Zimmer is also a multi millionaire and has all the toys in the world.

Plus he has got the best people to mix for him.

With that said, yes you are right, Cubase doesn’t change the quality of the export versus what is heard on the playback,

I thought that was the case to the extend that I thought the exported file was different from the playback to what was played back on another session which I was using to master.

I just exported a track on the actual session I used to create it, I rooted it on another stereo out and compared, there was no difference.

You are right, monitoring and the playback system plays a huge role.

[7am3s_UK]

The room also, if your listening in an environment where you hear a lot of reflections of the audio from the monitors you make decisions based on the reflections not the actual monitors.

I think a good set of headphones and some binaural software on the control room helps get an accurate sense of whats happening.

[Paul_Zaleski]

I’m a still active engineer/producer and composer. In a “real studio” you run into the same problems if your monitors and room are not " tuned" using white noise and 32-64 band equalizer, PLUS a “consumer” set…aka cheapest speakers we could fine. Times have change…I too run into this same issue using near field monitors…but NOT self powered. i produced and engineered two Grammys and did a very important mix using Cubase 13[ today. I played it back, and I was shocked…like comatose shocked. I’ve been using DAW since the DOS days. Always used Cubase, but NOT too many VST or audio files. I prefer midi and used soundbanks… They just sound “bigger”.

But with AI, I’m getting a lot of AI stems to remix projects.

So I’m screwed with audio files that sound like they are in a tunnel.

Before Cubase 13, I would export my mix to a completely different computer with .wav recording software. I would use an extra “passive” output of my amplifier to send the mix over to the other computer .

Here’s what I found out. When I use the "export "command in Cubase…I have no idea what happens, but it certainly is different than what I just mixed. I’m using an extreme gaming computer that can handle up to 64 audio tracks cleanly…but I think export function takes away “headroom” and maybe computer still not large enough to handle it…

But…when I do "live " mixing directly another to a separate computer with recording software on it…the mixes are identical…even better sometimes. Any good audio recording software works. ( Not NCH or Audacity). I use OEM factory Realtek soundcard too. I’ve have and used many others, but as time goes on I see no need to spend the money except for the ego and special needs.

I’ve also use a 32 band equalizer in the chain before sound gets to my speakers for accurate “sound replication”.

Generally, speakers are made to “sound good”. Engineers want (A) Accurate representation of what they are hearing from those speakers, because your hearing will determine what you do with your mix. (B.) Always have a decent set of near field monitors…Yamaha NSM10 non powered were the bomb…once you added one ply toilet paper over the tweeter. Near field…if you make a triangle and you sit at the point…like 3 feet apart speakers…and you sit 3 fit from the middle of the line from speaker to speaker. Put speakers at ear level, its about as accurate as you can get, as it , in most cases, deletes the bad acoustics of your room.

Then get a car speaker and mount it in a box…run your mix through that…as that’s as bad as its gonna get.

Some posts indicate mixing with headphones. NO…no way. you might use them as a reference , but everything sounds better in a mix…you want accuracy.

Don’t use limiters at all…especially input ,output.

You can learn to use “subtracting eq” in most cases to level something out, or do part over, or automate the level.

Mastering uses limiting…which is really squashing everything against the wall. Your music has no space to “breath”. Plus the streaming services use much of it , to get the songs to sound “even” volume between artists . I can hear the pumping of it on songs I mixed 40 years ago and songs I mixed yesterday.

Radios and You Tube are the worst offenders.

Try sending your mix to another computer, even a laptop while you are mixing live. I do use the automation to “ride” some levels. But less is more.

Hopes this helps. It reminded me I had an old laptop I can use now.

[Laopengyou]

Hi, it seems that there are many different causes to this problem, you bounce a mix in Cubase and it sounds so different played back on your mac or pc. I just had the same problem, but luckily I found the reason (Mac/UAD cards) I have a couple of UAD Apollos in a chain, and in order to use all channels with Ableton live, I had to create an Aggregate Device in the “Audio Midi” setup on my mac. Somehow I had input and output allocated to the PCI UAD, that created the problem. I switched them both (input and output) to the Aggregate device. That solved it for me 100% … Cubase and Wavelab exports sound now 100% like played on finder. Maybe thats helpful for someone. Cheers!

[Farfig]

This is the answer. I had the same problem. I would have Cubase open with a file, export it, and listen to the muted version side by side in the Windows Media player. I just opened in VLC and it’s fine. Sheesh.

[Hiya]

Use VLC as your default playback device because that is actually how your audio file sounds.
Don’t try to figure out why, just use it, trust it then forget about it and move on 100 %

[leif_stromberg]

Very old post I know, but if you’ like to share how to, that would be much appreciated.
Best regards
Leif

[Siegmund_Wagner]

Old post, but still the same issue for a lot of people, including myself. I have no idea how to solve this. I am thinking if it’s mostly about the fact that in project form, you probably have several Gigs of audio that will then be compressed down to Megabits.

[Reco29]

Disclaimer: I haven’t read all 128 posts in this thread.

However, this has nothing to do with Cubase/Mixdown in 99,9% of all cases. Usually, this has something to do with your mix and how you managed to come to that point.

It is much better to invest your time in mixing, mastering, tracking, arrangement and everything that defines a professional mix rather than blaming it on the mixdown.

Import reference tracks into your project and compare them to your mixdown (check the option "Import track after mixdown in the audio mixdown dialog). After bringing them to the same level (F7 DOP > Normalize > LUFS) compare them and you’ll see that the culprit is actually the artist/engineer and not Cubase

[Googly_Smythe]

Too quiet when I export

Cubase does not have a louder output. Sounds like you are neglecting a volume level somewhere.

Too quiet when I export

Another angle to look at it: Cubase handles volume independently from the rest of the system. Thus, it makes sense to compare two tracks within a system, use level readings/statistics and equally important reference tracks.

In other words, two separate audio streams.
Although, when I whack the Windows volume and my media player volume up to 100%, they sound the same as Cubase.

[Reco29]

You are right, @Googly_Smythe : although there are two independent “internal volume-systems” on a Windows rig - the material remains the same and it will show the same qualities.

Basically it boils down to two different dimensions:

1. The difference in internal volume level between Cubase’s ASIO driver and the core audio API of windows
2. The difference in loudness between a mixdown and a reference track. The latter involves everything that has to do with the art of mixing, arranging, tracking, performance, mastering - you name it.

These dimensions can be easily confused. That’s why I would always recommend to work with reference tracks within a given dimension at all stages of the process.

@Googly_Smythe

Although, when I whack the Windows volume and my media player volume up to 100%, they sound the same as Cubase.

Depending on your system settings there might be a difference, e.g. if you have accidently turned on some sort of weird EQ settings in Windows or in your Mediaplayer. I know they are there but I have it all completly turned off and so it doesn’t bother me.

Just to be clear - I am sure they sound the same on your system - these things can happen

EDIT: If Windows’ audio settings or the player have some sort of settings which alter the sound than we have a third dimension. Damn it…! Two dimensions sounded so nice and easy.

[Johnny_Moneto]

@Siegmund_Wagner

I am thinking if it’s mostly about the fact that in project form, you probably have several Gigs of audio that will then be compressed down to Megabits

You can erase this thought unless you export to mp3 or ogg. And even then there is no volume level difference.

Most people simply are not aware that Cubase uses another audio system to play back sound then all the media players and many other DAWs.
It’s the same computer but like two different devices. As if you listen on your phone and then in your car. That’ll also sound different.

[Reco29]

Just as a clarification for @Siegmund_Wagner :
If you play the level matched track on a player like foobar, vlc mediaplayer etc with no additional EQ settings etc neither in the player nor Windows and you route the signal to your audiointerface and the same speakers: there should be no difference at all.

If the track is routed to cheap little gaming speakers via onboard soundcard - there’s a car/phone difference.

[7am3s_UK]

Cubase/Nuendo (Software) > [Your soundcard/device] > Monitors/headphones

The most important part is the soundcard / device

what you hear when listening through a $3000 device with $5000 monitors will be different than if your listening through $500 device with $50 headphones.

The software gets interpreted by the device.

Your decisions are made based on the interpretation of what your hearing.

[Nuieve]

I sort of learned to live with it although it aggravates me to no end but I don’t have any desire to move on to another DAW. I saw a lot of people do (I think Hans Zimmer is the only one still in Cubase but he only does arranging afaik and not mixing so all these issues probably don’t exist for him)

Cubase has an endless sea of ignored bugs, annoying “features” and shortcomings… just have to live with them. It’s like an old Italian car… nice when it runs but it breaks down a lot and has a lot of dysfunctional and aggravating quirks.

[Reco29]

@Nuieve The difference in sound is not on Cubase. This is mainly the aural result of your artistic and technical abilities. Go ahead and compare other DAWS. Blaming it on Cubase and saying noone else apart from Hans Zimmer uses it anymore is inappropriate and nonsense.
Cubase, like any other DAW, is not perfect, true. But blaming your own shortcomings on it is not a solution to your problems. Up your game and you’ll see.

[Puli]

I mainly use vlc as a player (when not using DDP player for the mastered album) and when I play the exported wav files i set the same audio card i used with cubase in the vlc settings. No problems at all.

[Puli]

Any DAW mirrors your artistic and technical abilities. That’s it.

Same for the instruments.

[Graveley]

This thread makes me laugh so hard (and cry a little too).. You guys, I’m sorry, but… It’s not the software. It’s YOU.

[Reco29]

Respect if you really managed to read all 139 posts!

I guess this will never change as long as real human beings contribute to a mix. Finding comfort in blaming a bad sounding mix on someone or something else is just a human reflex. Which results in impulse buys. Plugins that promise instant success by doing all the work sell for a reason. This has always been that way - not just recently since it seems to become manditory to always label a product as “AI” enhanced.

Anyhow: I’d be a liar if I said I didn’t fall for that trap. Plenty of hardware and plugins around me. But each of these purchases were absolutly necessary. Of course they were.