Splitting stereo audio into two channels and some Wave plugins oddities

I have imported an audio file and used the split channels option. Now, that gives me a mono left and right channel obviously. But with the Dorrough Mono meter from Waves, when inserted on each channel only the left channel responds. The same thing happens with the Waves SSL G Channel Strip. All other plugins that I have tried appear to behave normally. When I examine the channel routing, the Waves plugin is bypassed on the right and cannot be changed, but the left channel is correctly routed and works fine.

I contacted Waves technical support about this and after some dithering they were able to understand me and duplicate the problem. Naturally their answer was to refer me back to Cubase. I think this is an issue with Waves VSTs as only those display this. But is there anything in Cubase that makes a split out right channel obey different routing to the split out left channel? I can’t imagine, but that is what I am seeing.

Now, this came up because as a relative newbie I had the concept that I would have more control if I split the stereo audio apart, but I now understand this is probably totally unnecessary and even I have seen it described as as ‘odd’ thing to want to do. So to a certain extent this does not matter. Nevertheless I am puzzled about it and the day will come when I definitely do want to split out the channels to work on each side separately.

The $64,000 question is, is this a Cubase bug or a Waves bug, or this how Cubase is meant to work in this use case (which is very strange if so)?

Cubase Pro 12.0.40, Windows 11.

Is this an accurate step-by-step on how to recreate this issue?

  1. Import a stereo wave file (sample rate and bit depth matters not?) with the “Split Channels” option ticked.
    Two Mono Audio tracks are created.
  2. Add Waves Dorrough Mono plugin as an insert to each of the imported mono channels.
  3. The “Left” mono channel responds normally but the “Right” mono channel does not.

Is audio played back as expected?

@mlindeb Yes exactly. Audio plays back fine. The routing for the channel shows a bypass that cannot be altered for the right channel only. It’s consistent and repeatable. Same for Waves SSL Mono Channel Strips.

On import, what happens if you import them onto two existing audio stereo channels? Create two channels in the project as stereo channels in the project with an arbitrary mono input, put the cursor at zero, select the first one, the mono audio will import onto the two stereo channel as two separate mono sources - with the advantage that you can use stereo effects if you wish.

Does that work around the problem or give an extra clue?

@Ian_Spencer thanks for your help. But I don’t understand what you are saying at all. The imported file is a stereo audio file, and I was wanting to split it into left and right channels on separate tracks. I tried to follow your instructions but you refer to importing a mono file I think. I am not sure what ‘arbitrary mono input means’. And the process described did not work at all.

I really don’t know but I can’t imagine this is correct Cubase behaviour. I do think it’s a defect with the way Waves plugins interact with Cubase - but whose side is it on? Note that they work fine when doing this in other DAW’s. I am caught between two worlds - always a hard software support issue.

I am dreading having to put in a support request to Steinberg as I get referred to Yamaha in Australia and from past experience not only do they not reply to email requests in any reasonable time but if they rouse themselves to do so they know nothing about the technical side of the products (this is harsh, but realistic. Steinberg hear my plea!).

And worse than expected - the Yamaha Australia web support page form wont let me paste two paragraphs of text or edit it. What is a poor soul meant to do? Yamaha hear my plea!

Yamaha?
How does this relate to the topic?

Btw, you mentioned no version number for the Waves VST. This could be of interest as well.

Yamaha Australia is who you get referred to when attempting to put in a support request to Steinberg, as I mentioned above. [Yamaha owns Steinberg.]

This behaviour applies to Waves V14.0.0 VST’s. I have not tried earlier ones as I do not have them.

I tried to import a stereo wav file with split option enabled, 2 mono tracks are made, inserted Dorrough Mono to both and it works as expected.
Is this how you show the problem? If so it does not repro on my system.

@TakashiWatanabe Ok that’s useful. Cubase 12.040, Windows 11, Waves v14.0.0. Are you using the same versions?

It’s on OSX12.5.2, the latest cubase& waves. So my procedure above is correct?

@TakashiWatanabe Yes. Hard to imagine this is a Windows only problem. But who knows?

More investigations. I am now convinced this is a Cubase defect.

If I approach this another way, the Waves mono plugins all work as expected. So, I import a stereo audio file directly into the Pool, where you are given the option to split into two mono tracks. Then I create two audio tracks and drop the split out tracks onto each audio track. All the metering and channel strip plugins from Waves work fine. This is not the case when importing audio via the Import Audio menu option.

I am happy to have a good way to so this, but it is a bug in Cubase 12.0.40 I am fairly certain.

How does one submit a formal bug report?

You might want to take a look at the channel with of the actual audio track created by you or by the split function. (mono vs. stereo)
If you split channels in the timeline, two mono channels are created.
If you put a stereo waves plugin on a mono channel, only one channel is available for the plugin, therefore it is only using the left channel of its available two channels.
I presume that you create stereo tracks when you manually create tracks.

Then, although you put mono wave files on then, the channels are stereo in signal path with.
An inserted waves stereo plugin will then use both channels.

Cheers,
Dirx

@Dirx Sorry, no. When I pull audio from the pool it is onto two mono audio tracks that I create, not stereo. I neglected the critical adjective. Then using mono versions of Waves analyzer plugins works fine.

It’s when you use split on import that the right channel does not drive the mono plugins.

I can demonstrate this at will, 100% repeatable. I’d class that as a bug. But thanks for your suggestions.

I do not have the meter Plugin, but if it has 2 channels, I presume that it is not the mono version of the plugin?
Testing with SSL Channelstrip here results as I would expect.

Cheers,
Dirx

Never said it has two channels. I believe I have repeatedly stated clearly here I am using the Waves mono versions. For me, the Waves mono SSL channel strips also show the same behaviour on the right channel. I have reinstalled a couple of times just to drive away demons, to no avail. The Waves mono and stereo plugins work fine in two other DAWs that I have. Going through this in fine detail with Waves support, they have referred me to Cubase, which is a dea end as mentioned above re Yamaha support for Cubase in Australia, most unfortunately.

Now if this works for you @Dirx then that means it is a local problem with my installation, and I could not possibly imagine what that could be. Hmm.

Uh, I think I misunderstood, I thought you were talkin about the “right channel” of the plugin itself.
:see_no_evil:
Now I took your steps and can confirm your Problem (Nuendo here), I cannot Insert a (working) mono Plugin on the “right” mono Track, that was created with the Import audio menu (split channel ).

Sorry for the confusion,

Cheers,
Dirx

1 Like

Now on the same page! :slight_smile:

Yet more to be said in this. Using split on import, the routing editor shows L on the diagram for the left channel that was split out, and R on the diagram for the right channel split out. But if I bounce the right split to the pool and put it back onto a mono audio track the routing editor shows M, presumably for mono. So there is an objective difference. I read one, one tiny unsubstantiated, casual reference on the internet that Waves mono plugins only respond to the left channel, which, although weird, is consistent with what we are seeing. My question now also extends to why does Cubase preserve information about left or right into mono split out channels on direct import? This tangle could all be part of it.

It would be great if somebody from the Cubase team could comment on this, but I do not know if they participate in the forum as they do on the Dorico forum.